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Australian Health Insurers - CPAP benefits?
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DeepBreathing Offline
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Post: #11
RE: Australian Health Insurers - CPAP benefits?
(01-18-2014 06:06 AM)me50 Wrote:  
(01-17-2014 10:13 PM)DeepBreathing Wrote:  IOur system is far from perfect but at least people in Australia don't face a choice between going bankrupt or dying.


not sure what you mean going bankrupt or dying.

I have overstated the situation, and I'm sorry for that - I didn't mean to offend. However, medical expenses are the biggest cause of personal bankruptcy in the United States, and it has been estimated that (pre-Obamacare) there were some 45,000 deaths annually attributable to uninsured people being unable to afford medical care. Further, the United States has by far the biggest medical cost per capita of any country, but the outcomes are inferior to the OECD average. Australia rates in the top ten for health outcomes while the US is about 45 or thereabouts.

The point I was really making was in reply to Zonk - our system in Australia is far from perfect, but it is a lot better than most. I would not trade our system for yours in America.

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01-18-2014 08:51 AM
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Lukie Offline

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Post: #12
RE: Australian Health Insurers - CPAP benefits?
(01-17-2014 10:13 PM)DeepBreathing Wrote:  It's all a question of economics, Zonk. They want young healthy people to take out insurance to help subsidise us decrepit oldies. If everybody waits till they're old and sick, the funds will not have enough money to cover us and all our procedures. It's the same for all types of insurance - careful drivers subsidise those who have a crash. So they've put in place an "incentive" to take out insurance early in life. Depending on your viewpoint, an incentive for one person is a penalty for others.

I don't know anything about the Swiss health system, but from what I've read about the American one (pre-Obamacare) it's not a model I'd want to follow. Our system is far from perfect but at least people in Australia don't face a choice between going bankrupt or dying.

I agree with you and I live in the US. We have too many people going broke from medical bills because they can't afford insurance. Obamacare is not a perfect solution but at least more people can go to the doctor when they are sick.
01-18-2014 08:01 PM
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Moriarty Offline

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Post: #13
RE: Australian Health Insurers - CPAP benefits?
The whole idea of Australian health insurance from the time it was recognised by the government (well before Medibank Mk1) was that it had to be based on 'Community Risk'. This is completely different to the Life Insurance policies that are based on an individual's risk.

The idea of community risk is breaking down as the community is aging with the risk profile becoming more loaded with the expensive conditions associated with old age.

The trouble is that healthy younger people are not joining up in the proportions of some years ago so, to attract them, most of the funds are now offering cheap policies with lots of exclusions. These policies are essentially skewing the notion of community risk and are, I suspect, responsible for at least some of the disproportionate increases in our premiums in the last few years.

The government has tried to help things by creating the life time loading that you refer to Zonk - but the reality is that instead of helping it repesents a further erosion of the concept of community risk.

I suspect that it won't be too many years before we see family and health history shaping the health insurance industry the in the same way that that applies in Life Assurance.

It is a slippery slope we are on....
01-19-2014 05:12 AM
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zonk Offline

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Post: #14
RE: Australian Health Insurers - CPAP benefits?
Thanks Moriarty, I did not knew about community risks. Next time (hopefully does not happen any time soon) If I need some surgery and there is long waiting list at public hospital, I'll shop around for doctors and hospital outside Sydney areas where costs are cheaper or even in other states. The rebate from Medicare is the same but doctors charges are higher in major centers
01-19-2014 05:39 AM
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Moriarty Offline

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Post: #15
RE: Australian Health Insurers - CPAP benefits?
(01-19-2014 05:39 AM)zonk Wrote:  Thanks Moriarty, I did not knew about community risks. Next time (hopefully does not happen any time soon) If I need some surgery and there is long waiting list at public hospital, I'll shop around for doctors and hospital outside Sydney areas where costs are cheaper or even in other states. The rebate from Medicare is the same but doctors charges are higher in major centers

Hmmm... I'll be interested t see how that goes for you Zonk...

I see the stats that around 80% of GP consultations are Billed but here in Toowoomba there are almost no GPs that Bulk bill and certainly no specialists - they are all in the Capital cities. There is not a lot of competition in the health industry any where - and certainly not in this part of the world...
01-19-2014 05:53 AM
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zonk Offline

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Post: #16
RE: Australian Health Insurers - CPAP benefits?
I,m wondering if the bankruptcy is not also due to mortgage default or/and credit cards debts
The other question is what those medical bills are for ... treating life threatening condition or some cosmetic surgery
Can someone please tell me, if someone required urgent medical attention and front-up hospital emergency dept in America, would the hospital treat the person free of charge or call security to throw her out in the street

Medicaid in the United States is a social healthcare program for families and individuals with low income and resources
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicaid
01-19-2014 04:49 PM
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me50 Offline

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Post: #17
RE: Australian Health Insurers - CPAP benefits?
(01-19-2014 04:49 PM)zonk Wrote:  I,m wondering if the bankruptcy is not also due to mortgage default or/and credit cards debts
The other question is what those medical bills are for ... treating life threatening condition or some cosmetic surgery
Can someone please tell me, if someone required urgent medical attention and front-up hospital emergency dept in America, would the hospital treat the person free of charge or call security to throw her out in the street

Medicaid in the United States is a social healthcare program for families and individuals with low income and resources
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicaid

hospitals are required to treat everyone in an emergency situation, money or not. Not for profit hospitals also will discount their fees based on income or lack thereof.

A lot of people hit the ER rather than go to an urgent care or doctor, especially if they don't have medical coverage. Those that don't have children, it is harder to get state medical coverage and at one point, they would not pay for organ transplants and those that did not have children were taken off of the state medical insurance. That has changed somewhat now and they will cover organ transplants again.

There are also hospitals for those that are indigent to go to for medical care. In the state we live in, they have a great burn center and other emergency departments that are not just for the indigent but that is the majority of their patients. In early 2000, our child was going to be treated for the medical condition at the burn center but the doctors in that state (not our state) refused to release our child because the insurance paid so well). We had a medical airplane and medical personnel lined up to transport our child here and it got cancelled due to greedy doctors who refused to sign the release paperwork for the medical transport. This was before the bottom dropped out of things.

I have been told that if someone files bankruptcy now, they cannot file based on medical debt. I have not researched this to see if it is true but I know that it was before the government to stop bankruptcy filings due to medical debt.

what is sad, is that people that are here illegally get government assistance, free schooling, free medical, etc. If people try and cross the border and become ill from heat stroke, etc., the state (and the taxpayers) pay for their medical expenses, pays for them to have their babies, etc. and it is sad b/c a lot of our own citizens don't get that and they work, pay taxes, etc.

When the market bottomed out and unemployment went sky high, that is when people started filing for bankruptcy because they couldn't find jobs or if they could find jobs, it wasn't enough to pay their mortgage. we (meaning the US)still have not recovered from it.

Fortunately, our home is paid for but what used to be worth $350,000 or more is only worth 1/2 that now because the market is still bad here and has not recovered.

Hope this answers your question a little bit.
(This post was last modified: 01-19-2014 05:23 PM by me50.)
01-19-2014 05:13 PM
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zonk Offline

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Post: #18
RE: Australian Health Insurers - CPAP benefits?
(01-19-2014 05:13 PM)me50 Wrote:  Hope this answers your question a little bit.
Thank you. I've learned also beside CPAP, houses prices in Australia are among the most expenses in the world
01-19-2014 07:27 PM
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me50 Offline

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Post: #19
RE: Australian Health Insurers - CPAP benefits?
(01-19-2014 07:27 PM)zonk Wrote:  
(01-19-2014 05:13 PM)me50 Wrote:  Hope this answers your question a little bit.
Thank you. I've learned also beside CPAP, houses prices in Australia are among the most expenses in the world

I am not sure what the housing prices are in Australia but in CA, housing is way expensive and most people that buy houses can't afford to do more than that in the way of entertainment, etc. It is my understanding that what we paid for our house, you can only get a really small house in CA. We have a few friends that live in CA and one of them bought land and put a modular home on it as it was less expensive than buying an existing house or having a house built.
01-19-2014 07:45 PM
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zonk Offline

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Post: #20
RE: Australian Health Insurers - CPAP benefits?
(01-19-2014 07:45 PM)me50 Wrote:  I am not sure what the housing prices are in Australia
Australian housing still among most expensive in the world
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/business/australia...z2qteN3Guy
01-19-2014 08:09 PM
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