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CPAP Machine doesn't blow air in morning like when I am going to sleep.
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Natasha Kleinhans Offline

Members

Posts: 9
Joined: Jan 2015

Machine: RESMED S9 Elite
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: RESMED QUATTRO AIR
Humidifier: RESMED Hi5
CPAP Pressure: 10
CPAP Software: Not using software

Other Comments: Also diagnosed with: High BP, Diabetes T II, Intracranial Hypertension, Heart Murmers & Tachycardia

Sex: Female
Location: Pretoria, South Africa

Post: #1
CPAP Machine doesn't blow air in morning like when I am going to sleep.
Hi Guys, I have a little concern. My CPAP machine is set on 10. In the evenings when I go to sleep, I can "feel" the air pressure. But when I wake up in the morning the air pressure is non excising, literately no air pressure or no air blowing. When I take the mask off my face while the CPAP is still on then suddenly there is allot of air pressure. Does the machine adapts according to my body's needs? I am still new to Sleep Apnea.

Regards
Natasha Kleinhans
This is how I feel lately:
Hammer
01-07-2015 06:46 AM
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DeepBreathing Offline
Wiki Editor
Moderators

Posts: 2,292
Joined: Sep 2013

Machine: Resmed S9 VPAP Adapt
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: F&P Simplus
Humidifier: Resmed H5i
CPAP Pressure: EPAP: 9 - 15 PS: 3 - 10
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Perth, Western Australia

Post: #2
RE: CPAP Machine doesn't blow air in morning like when I am going to sleep.
Hi Natasha, welcome to the forum.

I think what you're experiencing is the opposite of what you thought - the S9 Elite runs at a constant pressure and doesn't adapt to your body. However, your body adapts to the pressure overnight so you don't feel it in the morning.

Apart from that concern, how do you feel the therapy is going?

DeepBreathing
Apnea Board Moderator
www.ApneaBoard.com


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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
01-07-2015 07:02 AM
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Natasha Kleinhans Offline

Members

Posts: 9
Joined: Jan 2015

Machine: RESMED S9 Elite
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: RESMED QUATTRO AIR
Humidifier: RESMED Hi5
CPAP Pressure: 10
CPAP Software: Not using software

Other Comments: Also diagnosed with: High BP, Diabetes T II, Intracranial Hypertension, Heart Murmers & Tachycardia

Sex: Female
Location: Pretoria, South Africa

Post: #3
RE: CPAP Machine doesn't blow air in morning like when I am going to sleep.
Thanks!! Appreciate your reply, my therapy is working according to my Neurologist, My "readings" when diagnosed was 24 & 27 (What ever that means lol) but with the treatment I was getting the last few months it went down to 0.4 or something (That is apparently what the desired reading should be). Although the readings are great, I still feel tired during the day.

Regards
Natasha Kleinhans
This is how I feel lately:
Hammer
01-07-2015 07:48 AM
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DeepBreathing Offline
Wiki Editor
Moderators

Posts: 2,292
Joined: Sep 2013

Machine: Resmed S9 VPAP Adapt
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: F&P Simplus
Humidifier: Resmed H5i
CPAP Pressure: EPAP: 9 - 15 PS: 3 - 10
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Perth, Western Australia

Post: #4
RE: CPAP Machine doesn't blow air in morning like when I am going to sleep.
What you call readings is probably the apnea hypopnea index - AHI. This is in two parts: apneas occur when your breathing ceases completely for 10 seconds or more. An hypopnea is when the airflow is reduced by a certain percentage (typically 50%) or more for 10 seconds. Divide the total number of apneas by the number of hours asleep to get the apnea index (AI) and likewise the hypopnea index (HI) is the average number of hypopneas per hour. Add them together to get your AHI. The target is an AHI under 5 so it sounds like you're doing well.

It can take a while to start feeling the benefits of CPAP therapy, though for some lucky people it happens straight away. If you've had apnea for a long while your body needs time to undo the damage that has been done. In addition, there may be other issues preventing you getting a restful night's sleep, even though your AHI is well under control. This might include disturbances from mask leaks or mask discomfort.

If you haven't done so, download the SleepyHead software which allows you to see in detail everything which is happening, including each individual breath, any leaks etc. There's a link to SleepyHead at the top of each page on this forum.

DeepBreathing
Apnea Board Moderator
www.ApneaBoard.com


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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
01-07-2015 08:33 AM
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Jack_Russell_Fan Offline

Preferred Members

Posts: 81
Joined: Nov 2014

Machine: PRS1 760P
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: Tap Pap
Humidifier: PRS1 heated hose
CPAP Pressure: 15.5 - 6.5
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

Other Comments: Sleep Master wireless data transfer

Sex: Male
Location: Ellijay, GA

Post: #5
RE: CPAP Machine doesn't blow air in morning like when I am going to sleep.
(01-07-2015 06:46 AM)Natasha Kleinhans Wrote:  Hi Guys, I have a little concern. My CPAP machine is set on 10. In the evenings when I go to sleep, I can "feel" the air pressure. But when I wake up in the morning the air pressure is non excising, literately no air pressure or no air blowing. When I take the mask off my face while the CPAP is still on then suddenly there is allot of air pressure. Does the machine adapts according to my body's needs? I am still new to Sleep Apnea.

I frequently get the same sensation in the morning, even though I use a bi-level machine and I know it is working! Amazing what our bodies can acclimate too!
01-07-2015 10:56 AM
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trish6hundred Offline

Advisory Members

Posts: 6,430
Joined: May 2012

Machine: Resmed S9 AutoSet for Her
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: Fisher & Paykel Simplus
Humidifier: H5i Heated Humidifier
CPAP Pressure: 10 - 7-20 Cm H2O
CPAP Software: Not using software

Other Comments: I started CPAP in 2008. Totally blind since birth.

Sex: Female
Location: Missouri, USA

Post: #6
RE: CPAP Machine doesn't blow air in morning like when I am going to sleep.
Hi Natasha Kleinhans,
WELCOME! to the forum.!
You are getting used to the machine as it runs during the night and that's probably why you don't feel it when you wake up in the morning.
Sometimes it takes a while before you notice improvements, just stick with it.
Hang in there for more answers to your question and much success to you with your CPAP therapy.

trish6hundred
01-07-2015 03:47 PM
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herbm Offline

Preferred Members-2

Posts: 852
Joined: Jan 2014

Machine: ResMed AutoSet S9
Mask Type: Oral
Mask Make & Model: ResMed Airfit P10 Nasal Pillow
Humidifier: ResMed H5i
CPAP Pressure: 11-16
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments: Backup Mask: Innomed Hybrid FFM -- Oral+Nasal Pillows

Sex: Male
Location: Austin, TX

Post: #7
RE: CPAP Machine doesn't blow air in morning like when I am going to sleep.
With a really good mask and NO LEAKS you literally cannot feel the pressure.

Perhaps, you are even getting a better fit (the mask settles on your face or something). Most people have more trouble with leaks later in the night than earlier.

With the P10 nasal pillow mask, I literally need to let air pass straight through my nose and out my mouth to prove the machine is working.

Sweet Dreams,

HerbM
Sleep study AHI: 49 RDI: 60 -- APAP 10-11 w/AHI: 1.5 avg for 7-days (up due likely to hip replacement recovery)

"We can all breathe together or we will all suffocate alone."
01-07-2015 04:02 PM
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TyroneShoes Offline

Preferred Members-2

Posts: 505
Joined: Oct 2014

Machine: Resmed S9 Autoset
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: AirFit P10
Humidifier: Resmed H5i
CPAP Pressure: 10-14
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

Other Comments:

Sex: Undisclosed
Location:

Post: #8
RE: CPAP Machine doesn't blow air in morning like when I am going to sleep.
(01-07-2015 04:02 PM)herbm Wrote:  With a really good mask and NO LEAKS you literally cannot feel the pressure.

...

I literally need to let air pass straight through my nose and out my mouth to prove the machine is working.

I think we have to make a distinction between flow (air in motion) and pressure (a force that can cause air to move, or flow, only to where there is a lower differential pressure), and if we do that makes it easier to understand what is going on. Flow is a movement (of air); pressure is a force that can cause that movement, but only if there is a path available to where the pressure is different.

You never really feel pressure directly, because pressure does not imply flow (pressure by itself does not mean that air is moving). XPAP pressure can be actually quite high and you may not actually feel it other than when trying to exhale against it, and possibly even not then. The reason you feel an effect in that particular case is not due to pressure, it is due to pressure restricting the flow of you trying to exhale. The effect you feel is not directly due to pressure, it is due to the absence of flow.

But without a path to where there is a lower differential pressure (a closed system like your lungs has no such path available if your diaphragm creates sufficient pressure in the opposite direction) there is little or any flow different than normal breathing even if XPAP pressure might be high, and so it is difficult to actually feel that pressure.

Air does not have to be moving at all to have pressure. All air has pressure (which is something we do not really ever "feel", until the wind blows, although what we feel then is not pressure, it is flow), but the machine creates a higher pressure than normal pressure of surrounding air, and we may not even feel anything from that until there is flow (until the air actually is moving). Most of the actual flow is out the C02 vent; the flow in and out of your lungs is still pretty normal under XPAP.

The normal flow of breathing is really only changed by XPAP in that it prevents the airway from being restricted, so there is little change in feeling (because there is little change in flow) even when pressure is higher; another way to think of it is that with the added pressure of XPAP, you have the same airflow as someone who does not suffer from OSA at all, which is why it feels the same as normal breathing, even with pressure involved (and which is why it is so effective; XPAP is basically a 100% cure, directly in place).

Flow, on the other hand, is easy to feel. We feel the natural flow of air into and out of our lungs, but that is really subtle, and XPAP really does not change that dynamic other than helping prevent the obstructions that might otherwise occur.

But if you have a mask leak, or you open your mouth, that creates the opportunity for lots of flow (a path for the pressure to create flow is opened), and that flow is easy to feel; it can even wake you up from a sound sleep. Higher pressure can create higher flow (assuming the air has somewhere to flow to), so it seems like we feel the pressure, but what we actually feel is the flow.

The concept of opening your mouth to feel if the machine is even blowing is common, and it works because that allows flow to happen, which is easy to feel. The reason we need to do that is because pressure without significant flow is hard to detect. Everything feels pretty normal with the mask on and the blower running, that is until you try to talk intelligibly to your sleep partner, and then flow starts to happen and it sounds like you are talking underwater (and then she starts to laugh).

But bottom line, if you make the distinction between pressure and flow, it makes it easy to understand what is going on and why you feel what you feel, and why you don't feel what you don't feel, even if there is pressure involved.
01-07-2015 09:14 PM
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quiescence at last Offline

Advisory Members

Posts: 753
Joined: Nov 2014

Machine: REMstar System One with Autoflex
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: Quattro AirFit F10
Humidifier: yes typical setting = 4
CPAP Pressure: 5-13 Autotritrating CPAP
CPAP Software: SleepyHead EncoreBasic

Other Comments: CMS-50F Plus oximeter /w SPO2 Assistant software. Avowed mouth-breather switching to nose-breathing

Sex: Male
Location: US

Post: #9
RE: CPAP Machine doesn't blow air in morning like when I am going to sleep.
I just squeezed my tongue. I pressed approximately the same amount on both the top and the bottom. My tongue did not move, and my fingers did not slip off (past) it. It hurt. I think it was the pressure that made me feel that pain. I stopped doing it, and the pain subsided.
Smile

Dedicated to QALity sleep.
You'll note I am listed as an Advisory Member. I am honored to be listed as such. See the fine print - Advisory Members as a group provide advice and suggestions to Apnea Board administrators and staff concerning Apnea Board operation and administrative policies. Membership in the Advisory Member group should not be understood as in any way implying medical expertise or qualification for advising Sleep Apnea patients concerning their treatment.
01-07-2015 11:44 PM
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Natasha Kleinhans Offline

Members

Posts: 9
Joined: Jan 2015

Machine: RESMED S9 Elite
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: RESMED QUATTRO AIR
Humidifier: RESMED Hi5
CPAP Pressure: 10
CPAP Software: Not using software

Other Comments: Also diagnosed with: High BP, Diabetes T II, Intracranial Hypertension, Heart Murmers & Tachycardia

Sex: Female
Location: Pretoria, South Africa

Post: #10
RE: CPAP Machine doesn't blow air in morning like when I am going to sleep.
Thanks for all the replies!! I really appreciate it. I do have a better understanding of how it works. I have been having Sleep Apnea for years. Since I was in Matric and I am 32 now. My apnea was undiagnosed for years. It was only when I was diagnosed with Idiopathic Intracranial Hypertension (IIH). That out of frustration (because my Neurologist couldn't get my IIH under control) that he got the bright idea to test me for Sleep Apnea. I have been sleeping with a CPAP since April 2014.

Regards
Natasha Kleinhans
This is how I feel lately:
Hammer
01-08-2015 12:50 AM
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