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Chinstrap doesn't prevent mouth breathing, how to solve?
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Snurkel Offline

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Location: Netherlands

Post: #1
Chinstrap doesn't prevent mouth breathing, how to solve?
I'm 7 weeks in now, and have solved some newbie problems, like burping, gasping, struggling with my hose etc. but there is still one issue to solve, which is my consistent mouth breathing, or more: exhaling. Last night I woke up by a loud noise which sounded like "PFFBLBLBLBBBLUB!" which appeared to come from my mouth and which I was able to produce despite my (tight) chin strap.

How can I solve this? Should I ask for a FFM at my next appointment with the sleep analist? Are there any other options? I would appreciate your opinion since this issue seems to be the final culprit in improving my CPAP experience.
08-05-2016 05:13 PM
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richb Offline

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Location: Vermont

Post: #2
RE: Chinstrap doesn't prevent mouth breathing, how to solve?
(08-05-2016 05:13 PM)Snurkel Wrote:  I'm 7 weeks in now, and have solved some newbie problems, like burping, gasping, struggling with my hose etc. but there is still one issue to solve, which is my consistent mouth breathing, or more: exhaling. Last night I woke up by a loud noise which sounded like "PFFBLBLBLBBBLUB!" which appeared to come from my mouth and which I was able to produce despite my (tight) chin strap.

How can I solve this? Should I ask for a FFM at my next appointment with the sleep analist? Are there any other options? I would appreciate your opinion since this issue seems to be the final culprit in improving my CPAP experience.

Try the FFM. As you probably realize, mask issues are some of our most common. Look at what others have to say on this Forum to get an idea about different FFMs.

Rich

Apnea Board Member RobySue has posted a Beginners Guide to Sleepyhead Software here: http://www.apneaboard.com/wiki/index.php...SleepyHead
08-05-2016 08:56 PM
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pholynyk Offline

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Machine: ResMed AirSense 10 APAP
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Location: Ontario, Canada

Post: #3
RE: Chinstrap doesn't prevent mouth breathing, how to solve?
You should take a look at the Amara View, an unconventional full face mask that only covers the mouth and upper lip, and wraps around the lower edge of the nose. I've been using it for about four months now. It helps to be able to try it for size before purchase; the sizing guide did not work for me. It recommended the medium, which leaked around my narrow nose; the small works perfectly, once the straps are adjusted correctly. Fortunately my DME allowed me to trial both of them for a month. I've now used the small cushion for three months and it shows no signs of deterioration.

It's not as comfortable as the Wisp alone, but way better than the Wisp with the chin strap, which I needed to reduce my mouth leakage. Apparently as I got comfortable with the Wisp, my jaw started relaxing as I slept better... Sad
08-05-2016 09:35 PM
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Sleepster Offline
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Machine: ResMed AirCurve10 VAuto
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Post: #4
RE: Chinstrap doesn't prevent mouth breathing, how to solve?
(08-05-2016 05:13 PM)Snurkel Wrote:  Should I ask for a FFM at my next appointment with the sleep analist?

I wouldn't wait. It's expected that newbies will need mask changes. I would put in a call to them and tell them what's happening. Does the SleepyHead leak rate graph show extended periods of time where the leak rate is elevated?

Sleepster
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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
08-05-2016 09:38 PM
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PaulaO2 Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Chinstrap doesn't prevent mouth breathing, how to solve?
You've gone from opening your mouth (mouth breathing) to lip leaking (mouth is closed but air leaks out lips).

There's some things you can try but it will probably come down to FFM.

Move the chin strap forward, so the side straps hold your cheeks in. It could be that air leaks into your mouth first, sits there building up like a balloon, then leaks out the lips, letting all the air out plus air that is coming in from the mask.

Try the PAPcap. It is a cloth chin strap that is mostly for lip leaks but also works well as a "don't open your mouth" chin strap. If you don't sleep on your back, it works great.

Check out Daria's signature line where she gives instructions on how to do the tongue trick. I can't chew gum and walk at the same time and have never managed it.

I do not advocate lip taping or using denture cream to seal the lips. Others have great success with this but I see it as a disaster waiting to happen. Call me a pessimist but I'll not get choked nor get pneumonia due to aspiration when I could not open my mouth fast enough.

I use a FFM because of lip leaking. I use the Simplus. I also still use my Nuance nasal pillows mask. I am currently using the Nuance due to my machine is possessed by a demon and have discovered that the lip leaking is minimal so far. As time goes on, though, it is increasing, but slowly. The hardest part about FFMs is to find the right one for you and your face. Nasal masks and pillows masks can be shifted around and made to work. Not so with the FFM. It has to be the right one. Sure, you may have to use liners, but you'll know when it is the right one.

http://www.apneaboard.com/forums/Thread-...-going-FFM
http://www.apneaboard.com/forums/Thread-Equipment-P-s-fun-with-FFM

PaulaO2
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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
08-05-2016 11:07 PM
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Snurkel Offline

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Post: #6
RE: Chinstrap doesn't prevent mouth breathing, how to solve?
Thanks Rich, will do that. Maybe I also will find out if it has an effect on my tendency to swallow air and do the burps.
08-06-2016 04:00 AM
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Snurkel Offline

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Machine: Respironics Dreamstation Auto CPAP
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CPAP Software: SleepyHead

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Sex: Female
Location: Netherlands

Post: #7
RE: Chinstrap doesn't prevent mouth breathing, how to solve?
Thanks Paula, I doubt if a different kind of chin strap will work, since the air ends up in my mouth anyway via my nose and next I tend to swallow it, which leads to other issues.
But I understand you use the Simplus for the same problem and are content with the effect?

I practiced the tongue sucking technique from the start, but my tongue won't stick were it should. According to my dentist I have quite a big tongue which hardly fits in my mouth, maybe that's why it won't work.

I'll have a look into the Simplus, thanks for your suggestions!
08-06-2016 04:09 AM
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Snurkel Offline

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Machine: Respironics Dreamstation Auto CPAP
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Sex: Female
Location: Netherlands

Post: #8
RE: Chinstrap doesn't prevent mouth breathing, how to solve?
You're right Sleepster, why wait? SH shows a few periods of about 15 mins. each night of increased leakage, always around burping time.
08-06-2016 04:25 AM
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FrankNichols Offline

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Post: #9
RE: Chinstrap doesn't prevent mouth breathing, how to solve?
I went down that path, mouth breathing, and failed to solve it. I tried, tape (recommended by some doctors, not by others), gluing my lips together with dental adhesive, ace bandage wrapped over my mouth, dual chin straps, tongue sticking, etc, etc, etc... many many methods, some worked for a day or two before I would figure out a way to defeat it once asleep.

I ended up with the F10 FFM, and it has it's problems also, with being bumped around as I toss and turn, and spontaneous leaks when the pressure is over 15.5. I am still working on these problems.

What keeps me going is that I feel so much better when I get even a partially successful nights sleep, and the stories here of people that have managed to tame the mask beast...

Good luck and never give up!

I am not a Medical professional and I don't play one on the internet.
Started CPAP Therapy April 5, 2016
I'd Rather Be Sleeping
08-06-2016 04:41 AM
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Snurkel Offline

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Post: #10
RE: Chinstrap doesn't prevent mouth breathing, how to solve?
(08-06-2016 04:41 AM)FrankNichols Wrote:  I went down that path, mouth breathing, and failed to solve it. I tried, tape (recommended by some doctors, not by others), gluing my lips together with dental adhesive, ace bandage wrapped over my mouth, dual chin straps, tongue sticking, etc, etc, etc... many many methods, some worked for a day or two before I would figure out a way to defeat it once asleep.

I ended up with the F10 FFM, and it has it's problems also, with being bumped around as I toss and turn, and spontaneous leaks when the pressure is over 15.5. I am still working on these problems.

What keeps me going is that I feel so much better when I get even a partially successful nights sleep, and the stories here of people that have managed to tame the mask beast...

Good luck and never give up!

Thanks Frank for the heads up! I'm already looking into reviews of FFM's mentioned here; the Simplus and the Amara. They are of the same make as my current mask, which is very comfortable so I'm quite hopeful one of them will work out.
Will call the sleep madam on Monday, and see if I can get one here soon. Indeed, lets tame that breath and make it go where it should go!
08-06-2016 05:19 AM
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