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[Equipment] Airsense 10 or Aircurve VAuto Bipap
#1
Airsense 10 or Aircurve VAuto Bipap
Hello together, Fred from Germany, new to the board.

Ich was on the way for the Resmed Airsense autoset and. Some Admins have the Aircurve VAuto Bipap. There is a review and I read the Aircurve has a natural and comfortable breathing.

Now I am afraid, that the Airsense apap will be very difficult for me as beginner. Why not start directly with Aircurve bibap, when it is easier to breath.

- What ist the difference between     apap and VAuto . Is Aircurve only for the higher pressure  or could you use it also for 7-12 ?

- Could I use Aircurve Bipap as beginner with obstructive apnea ? Would it be easier to get used to the machine ?

My Budget ist 3000 Euro/Dollar, so both are in. But I do not find anything about Vauto.
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#2
RE: Airsense 10 or Aircurve VAuto Bipap
I copied this from Fred Bonjour post. There are a lot of different machines out there. It is hard to say which is the best for you without seeing a sleep study. Then Fred could tell you which might be best. With that said the VAUTO can be set up just like the 10s, it can be run as a CPAP or a Bpap. My DR. said he only used bpap. Many insurance co will not do that unless the tests show a need for Bpap. They cost more so you have to qualify. If money is no object AND you have no need for a more advanced and even more expensive machine, I would buy the VAUTO. BUT the one thing I would do is buy a resmed.

This info is from the ResMed Sleep Lab Titration Guide
• CPAP (continuous positive airway pressure) Fixed pressure delivered with optional expiratory pressure relief (EPR). It Treats OSA
• AutoSet/APAP (automatic positive airway pressure) automatically adjusts pressure in response to flow limitation, snore and obstructive apneas. It treats OSA
• AutoSet for Her/APAP Automatically adjusts pressure in response to flow limitation, snore and obstructive apneas along with an increased sensitivity to each flow-limited breath, providing a more comfortable therapy for women. Increases sensitivity to each flow-limited breath, providing a more comfortable therapy for women (OK for men too). It Treats OSA
• VAuto Automatically adjusts pressure in response to flow limitation, snore and obstructive apneas; Pressure Support (PS) is fixed throughout the night and can be set by the clinician. It Treats OSA, non-compliant OSA
• S (Spontaneous) Senses when the patient is inhaling and exhaling, and supplies appropriate pressures accordingly. Both treatment pressures are preset: inspiration (IPAP) and expiration (EPAP). It treats Non-compliant OSA and COPD
• ST (Spontaneous/Timed) Augments any breaths initiated by the patient, but also supplies additional breaths if the breath rate falls below the clinician’s set “backup” respiratory rate. It Treats COPD, Neuromuscular disease (NMD), Obesity Hypoventilation Syndrome (OHS) and other respiratory conditions
• T (Timed) Supplies a clinician-set respiratory rate and inspiratory/expiratory time, regardless of patient effort. It Treats COPD, Neuromuscular disease (NMD), Obesity Hypoventilation Syndrome (OHS) and other respiratory conditions
• iVAPS (intelligent Volume-Assured Pressure Support) Maintains a preset target alveolar minute ventilation by monitoring delivered ventilation, adjusting the pressure support and automatically providing an intelligent backup breath. It Treats COPD, Neuromuscular disease (NMD), Obesity Hypoventilation Syndrome (OHS) and other respiratory conditions
• ASV (adaptive servo-ventilation) Targets the patient’s minute ventilation, continually learning the patient’s breathing pattern and instantly responding to any changes. It treats Central or mixed apneas, complex sleep apnea, Periodic Breathing (PB)
• ASVAuto Provides an ASV algorithm plus expiratory positive airway pressure (EPAP) that automatically responds on the patient’s next breath to flow limitation, snore and obstructive sleep apneas. It Treats Central or mixed apneas, complex sleep apnea, Periodic Breathing (PB)
• PAC (Pressure Assist Control, also known as Pressure Control) The inspiration time is preset in the PAC mode; there is no spontaneous/flow cycling. Inspiration can be triggered by the patient when respiratory rate is above a preset value, or delivered at a set time at the backup rate. It Treats Neuromuscular disease (NMD), pediatric patients
ST (Spontaneous/Timed) Augments any breaths initiated by the patient, but also supplies additional breaths if the breath rate falls below the clinician’s set “backup” respiratory rate. It Treats COPD, Neuromuscular disease (NMD), Obesity Hypoventilation Syndrome (OHS) and other respiratory conditions


ASVAuto Provides an ASV algorithm plus expiratory positive airway pressure (EPAP) that automatically responds on the patient’s next breath to flow limitation, snore and obstructive sleep apneas. It Treats Central or mixed apneas, complex sleep apnea, Periodic Breathing (PB)
Apnea (80-100%) 10 seconds, Hypopnea (50-80%) 10 seconds, Flow Limits (0-50%) not timed 
Cervical Collar     Dealing w DME     Chart Organizing
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#3
RE: Airsense 10 or Aircurve VAuto Bipap
Thank you, you have also the Aircurve VAUTO. In Germany we have Resmed, Dreamstation and Prisma (Weinmann). The cheaper Prisma is the lover of the health insurance. I decided for Resmed. Sleep study will come in some weeks. As I see, BIPAP is also for the lower pressures. The PS is fixed, is it fixed in APAP too ?

I have to pay some extra money for sure, thats ok. But I will not go with the APAP when the BIPAP is much more comfortable to get used to.

Is there a reason, that admins prefere the VAUTO ? Buying the more expensive Aircurve is one thing, but first Airsense 10, difficulties to breath out and then Aircurve would be too much. Then I would prefer to go directly with the Aircure VAUTO, when breathing is more natural.

All the curves and software will come in some weeks.
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#4
RE: Airsense 10 or Aircurve VAuto Bipap
The Aircurve VAuto is a better, more flexible, machine.

I don't think your concern about trouble breathing is likely to be valid though, given that you say you don't need high pressure. The Autoset has EPR, which can act like a mini-bilevel.

If cost really is no object for you, or price difference in Germany is not that significant, get the VAuto.

Otherwise, I wouldn't worry about getting the Autoset.
Caveats: I'm just a patient, with no medical training. And my first experience with xPAP was fairly recent. So I'm somewhere along the path of a steep learning curve.
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#5
RE: Airsense 10 or Aircurve VAuto Bipap
Yes, PS is fixed in both AirCurve 10 VAuto and AirSense 10 AutoSet models.  In the AutoSet, it is called EPR and can only have settings of 0 (off), 1, 2, or 3 cm H2O.  In the Vauto, PS can be set between 0 and 10 cmH2O in increments of 0.2.

I used an AutoSet for Her for two years and am just now switching to a VAuto because it fits my needs better.  I don't think there is much difference in ease of breathing, though the increasing PS and changing the Trigger works well for me.  In my case, insurance paid for the AutoSet and will now pay for the VAuto.  Insurance required me to "fail" with the AutoSet before it would authorize the Vauto.  I told the doctor my problems and wrote an Rx for the VAuto and insurance approved it.

By all means, post your sleep study (with personal identifying information redacted) and get comments from some of the experts here.  (I am definitely not an expert on CPAP treatment!)
The current version of OSCAR is 1.2.0.  We recommend upgrading from any earlier version.

Useful links
Download OSCAR
Best way to organize charts
How to attach charts to your post

Membership in the Advisory Members group does not imply medical expertise or qualification for advising Sleep Apnea patients concerning their treatment.
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#6
RE: Airsense 10 or Aircurve VAuto Bipap
Thank you, that is very helpful. 

In Germany the prices are very different. For example the Autosense 10 for her is 1200 at the Resmed shop and 800 in other shops.

Aircurve is not so common.

Resmed and Prisma-Weinmann are in different cities, they have divided the country. So if I go in my city to the sleep study, I will get a Prisma-Weinmann, because there is a shop and the doctors only like the Prisma. 

When I go to the next city it will be Resmed.

The decision is before I make the sleep study. And the more I read and the more I look at the admins equipement, the more I read good reviews of the Bipap. But there is not much information.
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#7
RE: Airsense 10 or Aircurve VAuto Bipap
As you can see from the posts here, OSCAR is a great program for analyzing your CPAP performance and helping you refine your therapy. ResMed and Philips Respironics machines are well supported by OSCAR. Prisma-Weinmann machines are generally not well supported by OSCAR. So for that reason I would srtongly recommend ResMed machines.

(We'd like to support Prisma-Weinmann better, but none of the developers have one of those machines nor do any manufacturers supply the information we would need.)
The current version of OSCAR is 1.2.0.  We recommend upgrading from any earlier version.

Useful links
Download OSCAR
Best way to organize charts
How to attach charts to your post

Membership in the Advisory Members group does not imply medical expertise or qualification for advising Sleep Apnea patients concerning their treatment.
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#8
RE: Airsense 10 or Aircurve VAuto Bipap
I will certainly do, Oscar is great.

It is really a secret in Germany. And when it comes to aircurve it is strictly secret. 

When i have the machine I will report the first nights, looking for help here.

This board is fantastic, nothing comparable in Germany.

The price is high in the beginning. Aircurve is 1000 Dollar more than Airsense.
Take it for 5 years, then you have 200 more a year and 20 Dollar more a month.

I rather will have a machine, that satisfy me and make it easier to start with.

Thats why the decision between Apap and Bipap
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#9
RE: Airsense 10 or Aircurve VAuto Bipap
You might look at Supplier #2 on the suppliers list at the top of the site. They ship internationally and sell new and slightly used machines. I bout a used VAUTO for 800 US. They are an excellent company and many people have purchased from them.
Apnea (80-100%) 10 seconds, Hypopnea (50-80%) 10 seconds, Flow Limits (0-50%) not timed 
Cervical Collar     Dealing w DME     Chart Organizing
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