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[Equipment] CSA #'s that require BPAP or BPAP-SV?
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WakeUpTime Offline

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Posts: 156
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Machine: PR System One BiPAP S60 Auto 760
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: P10 pillows
Humidifier: PR S1 w Heated Tube+Hose
CPAP Pressure: Auto / Inhale 11-12.5 / Exh 9
CPAP Software: SleepyHead EncoreBasic

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Sex: Male
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Post: #1
CSA #'s that require BPAP or BPAP-SV?
I've been on CPAP only a few months since being diagnosed with "severe apnea" (AHI=40). After CPAP (pressure 12), the OSA is minimal (2-3) but the CSA is persistent at about 5-7 and won't let go. I get a good sleep until about 3am with CPAP but the rest of the night is just awake but somewhat paralyzed.

A BPAP (or PR "BiPAP") machine is said to help with CSA too. And, of course, for significant CSA, and AutoSV BPAP is the way to go.

Has anyone heard of what kind of numbers are needed before a CPAP user should go to a BPAP or a BPAP-SV, as a result of persistently high CSA data?

Sleep Apnea has given me a terrible memory. Please forgive me if I've repeated myself.
03-11-2014 03:29 PM
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trish6hundred Offline

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Posts: 6,446
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Machine: Resmed S9 AutoSet for Her
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: Fisher & Paykel Simplus
Humidifier: H5i Heated Humidifier
CPAP Pressure: 10 - 7-20 Cm H2O
CPAP Software: Not using software

Other Comments: I started CPAP in 2008. Totally blind since birth.

Sex: Female
Location: Missouri, USA

Post: #2
RE: CSA #'s that require BPAP or BPAP-SV?
Hi WakeUpTime,
WELCOME! to the forum.!
I don't know the answer to your question but hang in there and someone will be along soon, to help you.
Best of luck with your CPAP therapy.

trish6hundred
03-11-2014 03:43 PM
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WakeUpTime Offline

Advisory Members

Posts: 156
Joined: Jan 2014

Machine: PR System One BiPAP S60 Auto 760
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: P10 pillows
Humidifier: PR S1 w Heated Tube+Hose
CPAP Pressure: Auto / Inhale 11-12.5 / Exh 9
CPAP Software: SleepyHead EncoreBasic

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location:

Post: #3
RE: CSA #'s that require BPAP or BPAP-SV?
I don't see an option to edit a post, so just for clarification...
CSA = talking about Central Sleep Apnea events (or Clear Airway Obstructions)
OSA = Obstructive Sleep Apnea events

In summary, I'm just wondering about the general criteria of when someone is told to "move up" into another category of machine.
CPAP -> APAP -> BPAP -> BPAP-SV.
All machine types are representative in the Apnea Board.
For the BPAP or BPAP-SV users, do you happen to know the which criteria you had that brought you into the BPAP or SV category of machine?

Sleep Apnea has given me a terrible memory. Please forgive me if I've repeated myself.
(This post was last modified: 03-11-2014 04:44 PM by WakeUpTime.)
03-11-2014 04:43 PM
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me50 Offline

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Machine: resmed S9 VPAP Auto
Mask Type: Nasal mask
Mask Make & Model: Wisp and Silicone Head gear
Humidifier: resmed H5i
CPAP Pressure: 18/8
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

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Sex: Undisclosed
Location: USA

Post: #4
RE: CSA #'s that require BPAP or BPAP-SV?
I think it has to be much more than 5-7 CA's per night. 5-7 can be caused by increased pressure, waking up, going to sleep, maybe during or coming out of REM. Since you are really new to CPAP, it could be due to adjusting to therapy. Others will have more info to offer you. In the meantime, stick with it.
03-11-2014 06:11 PM
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WakeUpTime Offline

Advisory Members

Posts: 156
Joined: Jan 2014

Machine: PR System One BiPAP S60 Auto 760
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: P10 pillows
Humidifier: PR S1 w Heated Tube+Hose
CPAP Pressure: Auto / Inhale 11-12.5 / Exh 9
CPAP Software: SleepyHead EncoreBasic

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location:

Post: #5
RE: CSA #'s that require BPAP or BPAP-SV?
(03-11-2014 06:11 PM)me50 Wrote:  I think it has to be much more than 5-7 CA's per night. 5-7 can be caused by increased pressure, waking up, going to sleep, maybe during or coming out of REM. Since you are really new to CPAP, it could be due to adjusting to therapy. Others will have more info to offer you. In the meantime, stick with it.

Thanks for your msg. I'm new to Encore.
I think now that the "CA Index" (central/open airway) and "OA Index" (obstructive) are per hour rather than per night. (Sorry about my sloppy description. I'm a newbee.)

I'm at about 5-7 central events each hour. I do seem to have a bit of a problem in forgetting to (or not wanting to) breathe.
It could be temporary I suppose, but after a few months of nightly use, one would think it would settle.

Sleep Apnea has given me a terrible memory. Please forgive me if I've repeated myself.
(This post was last modified: 03-11-2014 06:33 PM by WakeUpTime.)
03-11-2014 06:29 PM
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me50 Offline

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Posts: 2,559
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Machine: resmed S9 VPAP Auto
Mask Type: Nasal mask
Mask Make & Model: Wisp and Silicone Head gear
Humidifier: resmed H5i
CPAP Pressure: 18/8
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

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Sex: Undisclosed
Location: USA

Post: #6
RE: CSA #'s that require BPAP or BPAP-SV?
(03-11-2014 06:29 PM)WakeUpTime Wrote:  
(03-11-2014 06:11 PM)me50 Wrote:  I think it has to be much more than 5-7 CA's per night. 5-7 can be caused by increased pressure, waking up, going to sleep, maybe during or coming out of REM. Since you are really new to CPAP, it could be due to adjusting to therapy. Others will have more info to offer you. In the meantime, stick with it.

Thanks for your msg. I'm new to Encore.
I think now that the "CA Index" (central/open airway) and "OA Index" (obstructive) are per hour rather than per night. (Sorry about my sloppy description. I'm a newbee.)

I'm at about 5-7 central events each hour. I do seem to have a bit of a problem in forgetting to (or not wanting to) breathe.
It could be temporary I suppose, but after a few months of nightly use, one would think it would settle.

EDIT: What was your AHI and the break down last night and maybe the 2-3 nights before?

it would be helpful if you know how to post your leak graph, pressure graph and event graph for us to take a look at. we can help you better if we can see the data. Also, what did your sleep study show? If you don't have a copy of it, request it in full, to include your data plots throughout the night.
(This post was last modified: 03-11-2014 07:08 PM by me50.)
03-11-2014 07:06 PM
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WakeUpTime Offline

Advisory Members

Posts: 156
Joined: Jan 2014

Machine: PR System One BiPAP S60 Auto 760
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: P10 pillows
Humidifier: PR S1 w Heated Tube+Hose
CPAP Pressure: Auto / Inhale 11-12.5 / Exh 9
CPAP Software: SleepyHead EncoreBasic

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location:

Post: #7
RE: CSA #'s that require BPAP or BPAP-SV?
(03-11-2014 07:06 PM)me50 Wrote:  What was your AHI and the break down last night and maybe the 2-3 nights before?
Data from the most recent nights (with CPAP)...
AHI = 8 / CA = 5 / OA = 2 / Hyp = 1 / RERA = 2

I thought there might be some general rule or formula of when someone might require a BPAP or BPAP-SV, when CPAP is insufficient as a result of continuing central apnea events.

Sleep Apnea has given me a terrible memory. Please forgive me if I've repeated myself.
03-11-2014 09:23 PM
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me50 Offline

Advisory Members

Posts: 2,559
Joined: Aug 2013

Machine: resmed S9 VPAP Auto
Mask Type: Nasal mask
Mask Make & Model: Wisp and Silicone Head gear
Humidifier: resmed H5i
CPAP Pressure: 18/8
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

Other Comments:

Sex: Undisclosed
Location: USA

Post: #8
RE: CSA #'s that require BPAP or BPAP-SV?
(03-11-2014 09:23 PM)WakeUpTime Wrote:  
(03-11-2014 07:06 PM)me50 Wrote:  What was your AHI and the break down last night and maybe the 2-3 nights before?
Data from the most recent nights (with CPAP)...
AHI = 8 / CA = 5 / OA = 2 / Hyp = 1 / RERA = 2

I thought there might be some general rule or formula of when someone might require a BPAP or BPAP-SV, when CPAP is insufficient as a result of continuing central apnea events.

looks like your AHI was 8 for the night with 5 being CA, 2 being OA and 1 being Hyp. Try sleepy Head and someone suggested and then we can see at what point during the night you had each event. How many hours did you sleep on the night you got the above data from?
03-11-2014 09:27 PM
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Peter_C Offline

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Machine: System One DS960HS
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: Mirage Quattro "MED"
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CPAP Software: EncoreBasic Other Software

Other Comments: Severe obstructive sleep apnea 1999/Just got an ASV machine

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Location: Akron, Ohio USA

Post: #9
RE: CSA #'s that require BPAP or BPAP-SV?
Bi-level itself does *not* help with CAs. In order to help with CAs you need to step up to an ASV machine. As for how many events are 'needed' for an ASV machine to be suggested, another will need to answer that.

FYI? CAs caused by CPAP pressure changes can take 3 to 6 months to ease on their own. And, some *might* suggest dropping your pressure by '1' and watching it closely for 3-5 weeks to see if it lowers the CAs without raising the OAs.

*I* am not a DOCTOR or any type of Health Care Professional. My thoughts/suggestions/ideas are strictly only my opinions.

"Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you. Jesus Christ and the American Soldier. One died for your Soul, the other for your Freedom."
03-12-2014 12:33 AM
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WakeUpTime Offline

Advisory Members

Posts: 156
Joined: Jan 2014

Machine: PR System One BiPAP S60 Auto 760
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: P10 pillows
Humidifier: PR S1 w Heated Tube+Hose
CPAP Pressure: Auto / Inhale 11-12.5 / Exh 9
CPAP Software: SleepyHead EncoreBasic

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location:

Post: #10
RE: CSA #'s that require BPAP or BPAP-SV?
It's another night of the persistent Central Sleep Apnea events (5/hour) on a regular CPAP machine.
Just wondering if they're part of "getting used to the new CPAP machine" or perhaps I really
do need an AutoSV machine to get rid of them altogether.

Sleep Apnea has given me a terrible memory. Please forgive me if I've repeated myself.
(This post was last modified: 03-12-2014 07:04 PM by WakeUpTime.)
03-12-2014 07:03 PM
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