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[Equipment] Nuance vs Airfit
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herbm Offline

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Posts: 852
Joined: Jan 2014

Machine: ResMed AutoSet S9
Mask Type: Oral
Mask Make & Model: ResMed Airfit P10 Nasal Pillow
Humidifier: ResMed H5i
CPAP Pressure: 11-16
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments: Backup Mask: Innomed Hybrid FFM -- Oral+Nasal Pillows

Sex: Male
Location: Austin, TX

Post: #21
RE: Nuance vs Airfit
PauloO2, you are very experience and knowledgeable so you already know this but for other people:

That whistling in the pillow is a (BAD) leak.

That means it is either a poor size choice, placed incorrectly, or it's been moved (e.g., by pulling on the head strap etc.)

A slight FLUTTER in the nasal pillow is bad enough -- feels like a fly crawled in and is fluttering his wings. Not tolerable.

But a whistle means the thing is REALLY leaking.

Any discernible noise or pressure is a sign of leaking.

Wind is cause by uncontrolled pressure differentials.

Humans cannot "feel" EVEN pressure caused by air unless there is a differential somewhere, even then, we generally only notice it if there is some sort of channeling (causes noise or focuses the velocity).

The different between a 20cm CPAP pressure is about the same as having (the midpoint of) your lungs 8" underwater with your mouth or snorkel just above the water. Almost unnoticeable.


Obviously the headgear wrinkling you nose is WAY BEYOND what will ever be comfortable.

Stretch it, modify it, or probably send it back.

This is the greatest deficiency of the P10: marginally adjustable headgear. There really should be an OPTION for an adjustable version.

I love it AS IS, but it happens to fit me perfectly.

Likely you (PauloO2) have a bunch of hair that must go inside the headband. One person did suggest a carefully positioned pony tale, but I am bald so even being a big guy my head (including hair) is not relatively large.

Sweet Dreams,

HerbM
Sleep study AHI: 49 RDI: 60 -- APAP 10-11 w/AHI: 1.5 avg for 7-days (up due likely to hip replacement recovery)

"We can all breathe together or we will all suffocate alone."
(This post was last modified: 04-04-2014 08:35 PM by herbm.)
04-04-2014 08:31 PM
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PaytonA Offline
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Posts: 3,019
Joined: Dec 2013

Machine: ResMed S9 VPAP Auto
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: Resmed Mirage Quattro
Humidifier: H5i(distilled-top up)
CPAP Pressure: VAuto MinE14.0 MaxI 20.6 PS4.0
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Orange County,California

Post: #22
RE: Nuance vs Airfit
Gee Herb your picture would never have led me to believe that you were bald. I just was not sure whether it was intentional or not.
04-04-2014 09:34 PM
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herbm Offline

Preferred Members-2

Posts: 852
Joined: Jan 2014

Machine: ResMed AutoSet S9
Mask Type: Oral
Mask Make & Model: ResMed Airfit P10 Nasal Pillow
Humidifier: ResMed H5i
CPAP Pressure: 11-16
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments: Backup Mask: Innomed Hybrid FFM -- Oral+Nasal Pillows

Sex: Male
Location: Austin, TX

Post: #23
RE: Nuance vs Airfit
It's both unintentional and intentional.

While I would rather not have developed pattern baldness, it was always my position that it would suck to get bald but have enough hair still to require hair cuts. Smile

So, buzzing it off with barber's shears is by intention.

Sweet Dreams,

HerbM
Sleep study AHI: 49 RDI: 60 -- APAP 10-11 w/AHI: 1.5 avg for 7-days (up due likely to hip replacement recovery)

"We can all breathe together or we will all suffocate alone."
04-04-2014 10:50 PM
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PaulaO2 Offline
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Posts: 8,068
Joined: Feb 2012

Machine: S9 Autoset
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: F&P Simplus
Humidifier: H5i
CPAP Pressure: 14-20
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

Other Comments: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome, Hypermobility Type; chronic sarcasm

Sex: Undisclosed
Location: western NC, USA

Post: #24
RE: Nuance vs Airfit
Nope, not a leak. It only whistles when I breathes out. Irritating as crap. Resettled, took off, put back on, checked to make sure it was on right, resettled again. No joy.

If I hold my breath, it doesn't make a sound. Soon as I breathe out, whistle. I can sleep through a lot of things but anything that has a rhythm, especially the sound of my own breathing, irritates me and I can't sleep. The older, thicker hoses used to just have the solid "woosh" sound to them. I used to could use them as kind of a white noise. But now they are so thin, I can hear the air going both ways and I can't stand to have them near my ears. Yes, I am weird. We've established that a long time ago.

Last night was my last try with this mask. I stretched it several times during the day then several times again before bed. But when I laid down, the part that attaches to the nose piece dug into my cheek. So I took the mask off and turned it around, thinking I had it upside down. But that was worse so I turned it back around. I eventually went to sleep but I have sore spots on my cheeks where the mask sat. My nose at least is not as sore but I feel like I traded one evil for another.

I have short hair. Not even close to enough for a pony tail.

The pillows part of the mask is good. I really really love how quiet it is! But the headgear is awful. They took the concept of simplicity too far. There is no "one size fits all" and ResMed should know better.

PaulaO2
Apnea Board Moderator
www.ApneaBoard.com


Breathe deeply and count to zen.

INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
04-05-2014 04:47 PM
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herbm Offline

Preferred Members-2

Posts: 852
Joined: Jan 2014

Machine: ResMed AutoSet S9
Mask Type: Oral
Mask Make & Model: ResMed Airfit P10 Nasal Pillow
Humidifier: ResMed H5i
CPAP Pressure: 11-16
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments: Backup Mask: Innomed Hybrid FFM -- Oral+Nasal Pillows

Sex: Male
Location: Austin, TX

Post: #25
RE: Nuance vs Airfit
Even that whistle on EXHALE is likely a leak also -- just one that only shows with reverse airflow and the extra pressure of the exhale.

Were I you, likely I would be giving up on it also, but there does seem to be something wrong with your descriptions vs. my experience and it is POSSIBLE you have a defective mask.

Probably the headgear is normal, and that might be enough for the mask to be usable to you.

But that difficulty with exhaling and the whistling make me thing that perhaps there is something defective about your particular mask.

Sweet Dreams,

HerbM
Sleep study AHI: 49 RDI: 60 -- APAP 10-11 w/AHI: 1.5 avg for 7-days (up due likely to hip replacement recovery)

"We can all breathe together or we will all suffocate alone."
04-05-2014 04:56 PM
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Gabby Offline

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Posts: 665
Joined: Dec 2013

Machine: ResMed AirSense 10 AutoSet For Her
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: Philips Nuance Nasal Mask
Humidifier: ResMed AirSense 10 For Her
CPAP Pressure: 8-14
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

Other Comments:

Sex: Female
Location: Sunshine Coast, Qld., Australia.

Post: #26
RE: Nuance vs Airfit
Last night with Airfit my AHI was 1.2 but my leaks were up and were 12 in the 95%.
I know 12 is ok as that is half under the 24 but I still find it a concern.
Should I find 12 a concern or not worry about it?
I had a bit of trouble adjusting the Airfit before I was settled last night.

As I have said previously I really want this mask to work.

Also what does it mean when you have red marks on your face? I used to wake up with red face before masks and now I sometimes still do, with masks.
Just wondering as I have heard red marks mentioned before on here.

Sleep Tight...
Gabby
04-05-2014 06:14 PM
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PaytonA Offline
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Monitors

Posts: 3,019
Joined: Dec 2013

Machine: ResMed S9 VPAP Auto
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: Resmed Mirage Quattro
Humidifier: H5i(distilled-top up)
CPAP Pressure: VAuto MinE14.0 MaxI 20.6 PS4.0
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Orange County,California

Post: #27
RE: Nuance vs Airfit
(04-05-2014 04:56 PM)herbm Wrote:  Even that whistle on EXHALE is likely a leak also -- just one that only shows with reverse airflow and the extra pressure of the exhale.

Or it could be the vent whistling. With my old Zest mask, when I was getting condensation in the vent holes, the mask would whistle every time I exhaled and I agree with Paula, it used to drive me nuts. Generally, in my case, all I had to do was reach up with my finger and wipe the outside of the vent holes a number of times and it would quit for at least a while.

PaytonA
04-05-2014 07:25 PM
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herbm Offline

Preferred Members-2

Posts: 852
Joined: Jan 2014

Machine: ResMed AutoSet S9
Mask Type: Oral
Mask Make & Model: ResMed Airfit P10 Nasal Pillow
Humidifier: ResMed H5i
CPAP Pressure: 11-16
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments: Backup Mask: Innomed Hybrid FFM -- Oral+Nasal Pillows

Sex: Male
Location: Austin, TX

Post: #28
RE: Nuance vs Airfit
(04-05-2014 06:14 PM)Gabby Wrote:  Last night with Airfit my AHI was 1.2 but my leaks were up and were 12 in the 95%.
I know 12 is ok as that is half under the 24 but I still find it a concern.
Should I find 12 a concern or not worry about it?

No, 95% 12 is NO concernt. It's half of the maximum you should be willing to accept.

My 64 day average (almost all P10) is about 8 at 95% -- this means I have days at 12 and 13 occasionally.


(04-05-2014 06:14 PM)Gabby Wrote:  I had a bit of trouble adjusting the Airfit before I was settled last night.

As I have said previously I really want this mask to work.

What does that mean? Trouble in what way?

(04-05-2014 06:14 PM)Gabby Wrote:  Also what does it mean when you have red marks on your face? I used to wake up with red face before masks and now I sometimes still do, with masks.
Just wondering as I have heard red marks mentioned before on here.

Mask marks are a REAL nuisance for some people and excessive with some masks.

Generally the P10 leaves little or no marks -- mostly my mask marks are fairly gentle (quickly disappear) OR they are on the "down side" as much from pressure between pillow and mask as from the headgear pulling.

I almost never have marks on BOTH sides (which would be due to the headgear.)

If the marks continue and you object to them (especially if they persist well into your morning) then consider one of the Pad-A-Cheek or other strap pads.

Sweet Dreams,

HerbM
Sleep study AHI: 49 RDI: 60 -- APAP 10-11 w/AHI: 1.5 avg for 7-days (up due likely to hip replacement recovery)

"We can all breathe together or we will all suffocate alone."
04-05-2014 08:09 PM
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herbm Offline

Preferred Members-2

Posts: 852
Joined: Jan 2014

Machine: ResMed AutoSet S9
Mask Type: Oral
Mask Make & Model: ResMed Airfit P10 Nasal Pillow
Humidifier: ResMed H5i
CPAP Pressure: 11-16
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments: Backup Mask: Innomed Hybrid FFM -- Oral+Nasal Pillows

Sex: Male
Location: Austin, TX

Post: #29
RE: Nuance vs Airfit
(04-05-2014 07:25 PM)PaytonA Wrote:  
(04-05-2014 04:56 PM)herbm Wrote:  Even that whistle on EXHALE is likely a leak also -- just one that only shows with reverse airflow and the extra pressure of the exhale.

Or it could be the vent whistling. With my old Zest mask, when I was getting condensation in the vent holes, the mask would whistle every time I exhaled and I agree with Paula, it used to drive me nuts. Generally, in my case, all I had to do was reach up with my finger and wipe the outside of the vent holes a number of times and it would quit for at least a while.

PaytonA

NO. The point of my comment was that the P10 is the quietest mask out there and does NOT whistle.

IF a particular P10 mask is whistling from the vent, then I would call it DEFECTIVE.

I literally measured the P10 with a sound meter and TRIED to make noise by exhaling hard.

This thing is VERY QUIET -- if it is working right.

Sweet Dreams,

HerbM
Sleep study AHI: 49 RDI: 60 -- APAP 10-11 w/AHI: 1.5 avg for 7-days (up due likely to hip replacement recovery)

"We can all breathe together or we will all suffocate alone."
04-05-2014 08:11 PM
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PaulaO2 Offline
Wiki Editor
Moderators

Posts: 8,068
Joined: Feb 2012

Machine: S9 Autoset
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: F&P Simplus
Humidifier: H5i
CPAP Pressure: 14-20
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

Other Comments: Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome, Hypermobility Type; chronic sarcasm

Sex: Undisclosed
Location: western NC, USA

Post: #30
RE: Nuance vs Airfit
(04-05-2014 04:56 PM)herbm Wrote:  Even that whistle on EXHALE is likely a leak also -- just one that only shows with reverse airflow and the extra pressure of the exhale.

Were I you, likely I would be giving up on it also, but there does seem to be something wrong with your descriptions vs. my experience and it is POSSIBLE you have a defective mask.

Probably the headgear is normal, and that might be enough for the mask to be usable to you.

But that difficulty with exhaling and the whistling make me thing that perhaps there is something defective about your particular mask.

No, it just shows why there are so many masks on the market. The Nuance and the Airfit are so much alike yet, very different.

I doubt the mask is defective. Why would on size make the noise and the other two not? They all fit into the frame the same way. And trust me, the noise is not from a leak.

Payton, I've had that condensation noise before, too. But this is when I first put the mask on.

PaulaO2
Apnea Board Moderator
www.ApneaBoard.com


Breathe deeply and count to zen.

INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
04-05-2014 08:15 PM
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