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[Health] Which country has the best health care system?
#1
According to a recent study published in The Lancet, Andorra tops the league table for the best health care system in the world, across a wide range of measures. Most of the top ten are in Western Europe. Australia comes in at number 6 and the USA is in 35th place.

The full paper (rather long and complicated) is here: http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet...8/fulltext

and an abridged summary is here: https://medicalxpress.com/news/2017-05-c...hcare.html
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#2
Quote:Among rich nations, the worst offender in this category was the United States, which tops the world in per capita healthcare expenditure by some measures.

'Murica!


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#3
Spain without a doubt, the six that are ahead are merely testimonials, Andorra, Switzerland Iceland, etc. are the size of a neighborhood of NY. The extraordinary thing is to give free health coverage to overpopulated nations, Europe is at the top.

Spain is the first in the world, not  profit in donation and organ transplants, are prohibited payment by donation, the problem is the waiting list, about six months for kidney transplantation

UK before the era MargaretTeacher was number one, now it is sunk in the posts of the queue, in Spain we have hundreds of thousands of English, Norwegians, Germans, Swedes enjoying Spanish health where, for example, European retirees only pay the 10% of the price of medicines. Ah! And the prices of these are 10% of the prices in the USA.
Do not forget Hungary, it's a place below the USA, but its health treatments are excellent and the cheapest ones for non-EU citizens.

I have my daughter and grandchildren born in the USA this country recognizes dual nationality with Spain, Someday I will tell the story of my precious granddaughter, Thanks to the Spanish and French healthcare we are not bankrupt, the US healthcare would have ruined the whole family.

Sorry
Google Translate,
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#4
World leaders in organ transplants 2015 per million inhabitants, neither the donor receives money nor the recipient costs a Euro.

This photo is in Spanish, I think it's understood

[Image: Record-en-donacion-de-organos-suben-un-1...ge990_.jpg]
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#5
It's easy to top nations like the US that spends tons of medical dollars on research, Uni's etc.
The amount of research we do dwarfs most of these other nations entire systems.
We also have an uncounted number of freeloaders, although Europe is trying it's hardest to catch up in that area.

If we just applied existing drugs and procedures with their rates of research a lot of our states would beat their nations, not to mention the whole country moving way up on the list.

Top notch healthcare is not the same as cost or having access, the major metric for these rankings.
Good healthcare is very expensive everywhere, so what is "best" is very subjective.
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#6
Personal111 - that's an interesting point you raise. I wonder if medical research is counted in the cost of healthcare for this type of survey. I suspect not, but I don't know.

Quote:Top notch healthcare is not the same as cost or having access, the major metric for these rankings.

Having the best surgeons or high tech equipment might give "top notch" care for those who can afford to access them. But they count for nothing if the majority of the population doesn't have access to them. What is "better": $$$ hi tech medicine available to a few, or more basic healthcare available to everybody?
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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
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#7
True, great or best is all how you define it.

That's the big ugly question we have to answer in a reasonable fashion and quit hiding our heads in the sand.
If we want a single payer type health system, (which I am not for or against, would depend on implementation) we have to decide just how much care and research we are willing to pay for and how much we are willing to spend on individuals.
Healthcare is a limited resource with infinity wants.

We can't keep pretending that we can spend limitless amounts of money on endless amounts of people and never have to pay for it.
That has been the way we have been discussing it for 50 years and it just does not work.
What we are doing now is just destroying the quality of doctors and nurses etc. which will affect us for a long time.

Solving a problem like this is not easily done politically, would probably be better to let AI do it.
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#8
It's natural to defend what you know. There has been a drive to form political opinions on healthcare and for some reason the universal system is seen as a boogeyman. It isn't.

Until the US has bipartisan politics on healthcare and has the backbone to leave the large political donations behind...the system will continue to be broken. Any fair evaluation of the system will show it is broken. Even when you have it, the copays and such can make it unaffordable to use it.

Universal systems like australia's are 2 tier and incorporates a 'same premium loading for all' private system. you don't pay 5 times the premium because of an existing illness or age loading.

the US system has so many pigs in the trough, that it is costing twice what an equivalent universal system would. The money is there, it's just getting skimmed off.
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#9
Currently about 45% of all medical research spending is spent by the US.
It is actually down from over 51%. It is far easier and cheaper to train staff and treat patients with established procedures and drugs that are past patent dates. (Or just import them from countries that don't honor those patents.)
You have your R&D paid for you.

The only nation even close to us is China.
Numbers in billions rounded off:
US 473
China 409
European Union 388
Japan 180
Germany 109
S. Korea 92

The US does almost 100 billion more in R&D than the ENTIRE European Union.
Comparing these smaller countries to the larger ones is not really comparing apples to apples.

Do we need more efficiency?
I sure believe so, but I am not convinced that somehow our healthcare is that terrible.
What these other nations do is get more routine treatments and drugs to the masses and that has a big bang for the buck as there is a lot to treat.
What they don't do is a heck of a lot less R&D and their standards of adequate care are lower.
The more advanced your system is, the more expensive the lowest level of care becomes as our idea of "standard" becomes higher.

The political part is unavoidable.
Spending and collecting tax money is a political act carried out by politicians in a legislature. There is no lack of fraud in medicine across the pond either.
I have lived in 3 European countries, 1 Asian country, and here.
My son was born in a German hospital and I have been treated for various things in all those countries.

The grass may be greener on the other side of the fence in some areas, but be careful what you demand of your legislature. The old "it's always better in Europe" meme plays well with people who have never been able to experience both sides which is most people.

We do, as a society, have to make an honest decision about how much healthcare we are willing to pay for. Good healthcare is expensive and there is no way to give everyone top level healthcare when most are paying nowhere near what it costs. A lot of voters are extremely naive and think that somehow that will work and it's just "Big Medicine" or "Big Gov" holding out on them.
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#10
I tend to agree with personal111. Although some medical related things here seem to be expensive in upfront cost insurance does help quite a bit. Plus the level of care I have received (both with and without insurance) has been crazy good. I had my stroke while uninsured. I had a long hospital stay and both inpatient and outpatient rehabilitation in one of the best places in my state. My "bill" was nearly $800,000. I applied for financial aid through the treating hospital plus through some local churches. I ended Have actually having to pay out of my own pocket about $3,000 for all that care. And this was very very high quality care... it was WELL worth the $3,000 and probably the $800,000 too as it was life saving and day one after the stroke I couldn't walk, now I can.

I think the biggest misconception people overseas have about our healthcare system here is that you really can't be turned down for critical medical treatment based on lack of insurance or ability to pay the full amount due. And even IF a medical bill were to go to collections and unpaid and end up on your credit report, generally medical entries on credit reports are largely overlooked by banks, and creditors. Our healthcare here was never ever as bad as people in other countries seem to think it is. If I were to take a random guess at the biggest culprit of higher healthcare costs here it would be the insurance companies... but I don't know that for sure.
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