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How to stop FOT arousals?
#21
RE: How to stop FOT arousals?
I know what MSE is, not really talking about AHI right now. I am just confused why decongestants help, seems like you have two issues (narrow airways and congestion caused by dilated blood vessels).

Not sure if you have tried antihistamine or steroid sprays, a combo spray called Dymista works way better than either on their own. Worth trying if you haven't already done so, might be able to get off the decongestants with it.
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#22
RE: How to stop FOT arousals?
@ OP

regarding MSE: I will read around this but in the meantime would like to ask some questions if I may...

up to what age can this be used? 
Is it painful? 
any effect on the teeth? 
How to long for this to work? 
Is it 24//7 or night time only? 
can you use this if you have crowns/fillings/restorations etc?
how to do they measure the results: clinical measurements or imaging?
Is there a target change in anatomy you are aiming at in mm or some such size at which stage you know to stop?

Only asking because I notice with my F30i FFM I seem to think my bite is changing even at age 60+.
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#23
RE: How to stop FOT arousals?
Isn't FOT just the method the machine uses to work out if the airway is clear and therefore to judge if an apnea (if it occurs) is probably centrals or obstructive? It doesn't treat anything per se, right?


See my comparison of Viatom/Wellue and CMS50F oximeters here.

Not a doctor, definitely not your doctor, all advice is given as-is and represents simply my own understanding as a fellow patient and OSCAR user.
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#24
RE: How to stop FOT arousals?
Correct on FOT, it's air sonar so to speak. Air pulses to measure resistance for one that's not breathing. No breath and no resistance equals the CA flag.
Dave

OSCAR
Standard OSCAR Chart Order
Mask Primer
Dealing With A DME
Soft Cervical Collar Wiki
INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEBSITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
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#25
RE: How to stop FOT arousals?
SevereApnea, MSE is usually done in children up to young adults and is most effective at younger ages because you can do it easier as the jaw is more flexible and will adapt and heal more readily. I believe it is rarely done in older individuals and that surgical processes are more often required to perform the procedure although it can still be done.

It does have effect on teeth as it literally spreads them apart and changes your entire bite. This process is most commonly used to correct issues like crowded teeth, improving airways is a secondary process. I believe you need to get braces after the procedures is complete in order to correct teeth/bite.

If your bite is changing etc you would be best to ask dentist about it and see if he thinks it is worthwhile to see an orthodontist about to see what they recommend.
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#26
RE: How to stop FOT arousals?
Here is last night's Oscar info after running 13/10. 

As far as I know, the MSE appliance is usually not used on people over their 40s (although at that age a surgical assist might still be affective). Because the midpalatal suture fuses when you're 15-16, after that age to expand the maxilla you have to use a bone-borne expander that screws into the palate. I am 21 and got corticopunctures (tiny drill holes along the suture to help me split faster) and just split recently and starting to expand. If the turbinates are inflamed, they must be inflamed by something. I already tried antihistamines, Flonase, etc. but didn't notice any improvement. By increasing the overall size of the nasal cavity, you are decreasing airway resistance and also decreasing inflammation (Non-allergic rhinitis). 

The MSE installation was uncomfortable but not much more painful than a cavity filling. They apply topical anesthetic to numb the area, before screwing the custom appliance into the maxilla. Everyday it is turned or "activated" with a key/wrench-looking thing which expands the palate. This increases the size of both the nasal cavity and the oral cavity to improve sleep and breathing. I feel like my breathing has already started to improved since "splitting", but it will take months to fully expand and allow the bone to regrow where the suture split. If I can get a full centimeter of expansion, that will be huge and should really improve my sleep quality. But not everybody will expand that much.


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#27
RE: How to stop FOT arousals?
Your I:E ratio is more inline with expected, you used a decongestant last night though? Probably a better chance that improvement was due to being able to breath through nose (if that was the case) then the lower PS. Either way was just one night so need to get some more data to see if the trend sticks.

There is something about the combo spray Dymista that works best for nonallergic rhinitis. They still don't know exactly why but it is one of the go to medications and far more effective then antihistamine or steroid alone.
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#28
RE: How to stop FOT arousals?
(06-27-2021, 03:04 PM)Geer1 Wrote: Your I:E ratio is more inline with expected, you used a decongestant last night though? Probably a better chance that improvement was due to being able to breath through nose (if that was the case) then the lower PS. Either way was just one night so need to get some more data to see if the trend sticks.

There is something about the combo spray Dymista that works best for nonallergic rhinitis. They still don't know exactly why but it is one of the go to medications and far more effective then antihistamine or steroid alone.

Yes, I used Afrin then taped my mouth shut last night. But tonight I will be mouth-breathing to get a control. I will be running the same settings (13/10), then the following night I am planning on trying 15/10 and see how that goes and compare/contrast.
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#29
RE: How to stop FOT arousals?
Here is my data from last night. I am planning on running 15/10 tonight and see how that goes.


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#30
RE: How to stop FOT arousals?
Stats don't look that bad. I'm thinking edits need to be comfort based if you keep seeing OSCAR look like this.
Dave

OSCAR
Standard OSCAR Chart Order
Mask Primer
Dealing With A DME
Soft Cervical Collar Wiki
INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEBSITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
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