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Is it worth dropping pressure to get over leaks
#1
Hi
I run a pressure of 15 and the leaks in the mask are driving me nuts.

I have F&P Simples but recently borrowed a Resmed Airfit F10.

I like the Resmed a bit better as the stars are more comfortable.

The only way I have been able to get lower leak rates is to tighten the straps on both machines very tight.

My AHI figures are good <5 and better. Mind they always look better if you are up all night messing around with the mask Smile.

The machine says I have a good mask fit but it is at the other end and does not know about all the annoying blurps and leaks.

The resumed mask seems to be the worst for leaks.

So I was thinking of just dropping my max pressure back to 10 - fixed. I can try this but want to make sure this is not a bad thing to do.

I will also try some mask liners, tried to make one but ended up to small.

As said I can reduce the leaks but I have to have the mask very tight which I believe is required for a pressure of 15.

Richard

Richard

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#2
I know you don't want to hear this, but, I was in the same place a few months ago and figured out how to lower the leaks with the F10.

You profile indicates that you are running in CPAP mode with a pressure of 15. Set the panel to mask fit test and follow these instructions.

It takes time. The first step is to stop tightening the straps so tight. The F10 works by inflating the thin silicone seal around the edge next to your face. IN order to work, the mask has to be loose enough to allow that seal to inflate.

Loosen the straps a lot. Lay on your back and turn on the machine. Put the mask on and slowly tighten the straps one at a time, in a circle to tighten all 4 about 1/8 inch. Wait, breath, lift the mask a little and let it settle back down. Then if it leaks, do it again - another 1/8 inch all around.

Keep doing that until it floats, you will feel the seal inflate. Keep slowly tightening until it stops leaking when . you lying still, and not moving and on your back. If you get it to the point the hard plastic is resting on your nose bridge then the top it too tight - loosen the top straps a 1/4 inch or so and tighten the lower straps a little - that will rock the mask away from your bridge. You will find a point where the seal inflates and if you are lying still on your back it will not leak. If you blink, it can leak for a second, if you twitch your mouth it can leak for a moment - don't worry about those. Just relax and lay still.

Now once it is not leaking the next step is to turn your head to one side and/or the other. If it starts to leak, go back to facing up and tighten the straps a little - maybe 1/8 inch each. Do not rush this, there is a very small range of adjustments where it will work.

Repeat the above until your can turn your head side to side and not cause a leak. If you have tightened the straps to the point the hard plastic is hitting your face before the leaks have stopped - you have gone too far, loosen them and try again. Once you can pass the side to side test, go to sleep and see how you numbers look in the morning - be mostly concerned with the leak rate.

Follow that routine for a few weeks - it took me about a month and a half (6 weeks) to get so that I get very few major leaks at a pressure of 20.

Frank
I am not a Medical professional and I don't play one on the internet.
Started CPAP Therapy April 5, 2016
I'd Rather Be Sleeping
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#3
Frank
Thanks for that. It is good to hear other peoples stories. I have the F10 for a couple of months trial so will hopefully get it better.

As I mentioned I can cut the leaks but feel the mask is becoming part of my face.

I have tried something like what you said but you must be a patient man. We are metric here and I have never come to grips with it so I do more than 1/8 inch Smile

The F10 does feel more comfortable to me than the F &P Simplus, which I own. I was given the simplus at my sleep study and did not know any different and had never heard or was even told about resmed machine or masks so just went with what I was given.

My problem for not doing the research beforehand I guess. It all was a bit of a rush.

I may have ago at mask liners or padacheek leak thing as well but they seem to be a bit more a hassle but will give your approach with a lot more patience ago first.

Many thanks for the help

Richard
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#4
1/8 inch is about 3mm.
I am not a Medical professional and I don't play one on the internet.
Started CPAP Therapy April 5, 2016
I'd Rather Be Sleeping
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#5
I can visualise 1/8" or a foot or a yard but I just can't with metric. We have been on the metric system for many years, just I haven't Smile.

I will give it a go tonight.

Thanks again

Richard
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#6
Frank,
Tried your approach but without success.

Well before going to bed I went through the procedure and all good if i laid only on my back but got the popping and leaks when I went to the side.

I did eventually get some result consistency but it was tight.

Any way out of frustration I dropped my pressure to 10 to test and no problems. So I set it to 12 for the night.

It seemed to go OK but had lots of trouble around 2-3am and swapped over to my Simplus mask for the remainder

Dropping to 12 does not seem to have caused any issues but time will tell.

RIchard
[attachment=2856]
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#7
I understand, it took me a month or two before I finally got it to stop with all the noise and leaking. Good luck, I am sure someone else can chime in on other things to try.
I am not a Medical professional and I don't play one on the internet.
Started CPAP Therapy April 5, 2016
I'd Rather Be Sleeping
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#8
Frank
I very much appreciate your help

A systematic approach to putting on the mask is much better than what I had. Nothing

I was going to give up on the resmed mask as I could not get it to work until your help.

I find it is a better fit.

After going through the process it went well initially and works well if I am on my back but when I lay on my side the mask moves unless I tighten straps very tight

I tried your approach on the simplus as well but that extra strap over the head complicates it all as it changes the pressure of the straps

It also worked well for awhile but seems to handle laying on the side better than the resmed
I will keep the resmed for a couple of months and may even buy one as having twin helps as I am about to go traveling

I like and dislike things about both masks

I reckon the air disperser on the simplus is much better than the resmed but the simplus seems a bit big as it sits lower on my chin

Any way more testing and troubled nights ahead I guess


Many thanks again

Richard

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#9
The burps and leaks you got from the F-P Simplus were probably because they gave you a LARGE size mask to start with. Try a MEDIUM sized Simplus, and I'll bet your leak problems will lessen greatly, if not completely disappear. Another trick I used to stop the leaking in both the masks you are using is a neat little device called the CPAP Comfort Cover. I am not trying to sell them, they are available on Amazon, and slip over the masks to go between your skin and the silicone plastic of the mask. They work especially well if your beard grows fast (as mine does). These covers are hand washable in mild soap, and can be squeeze dried, then air dried. I do mine once a week. They are completely re-useable, and only have to be trimmed to fit your face when they are slipped over the mask.

Good luck.
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#10
To go from 15 down to 10 is simply too much. I have two suggestions. Drop down to 12 and see if the leaks reduce and then gradually increase until you feel you have a beneficial leak->pressure. Alternatively, reduce pressure every night by .2 until the leaks are down to what you can stand.

I am at 12.5 and do not get regular leaking with the P10 and I don't have it on that tight. Obviously, faces and noses are different. Maybe you don't have the right size of pillows?

I have 5 masks and none are perfect because I feel that I'm between sizes. Still, I've been able to get all 5 to work for me within reason. I am not a light sleeper - if you are, it could easily become a grind.
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