Hello Guest, Welcome to Apnea Board !
As a guest, you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use.
To post a message, you must create a free account using a valid email address.

or Create an Account


New Posts   Today's Posts

Lip Leak
#1
Lip Leak
I'm trying to switch from a FFM to a nasal mask with chin strap but I'm having trouble with lip leakage during the night. I usually start out the night with my tongue to the roof of my mouth but I'm pretty sure it doesn't stay there for very long once the lights go out.

The chin strap does a good job at keeping my mouth closed. I've been using it along with my FFM for a couple months now so I've gotten used to it. Once the air forces my lips open I start making raspberrys which cause me to wake. Any advice on what works for this besides duct tape/stitches which can be deadly?
Post Reply Post Reply
#2
RE: Lip Leak
I fought the lip leak battle but did not win it. Ended up going to a FFM. I think that I tried everything except taping. I hope that you do better than I did.

Best Regards,

PaytonA

Admin Note:
PaytonA passed away in September 2017
Click HERE to read his Memorial Thread

~ Rest in Peace ~
Post Reply Post Reply
#3
RE: Lip Leak
You really don't want to "force" your mouth to stay shut. So taping, stitches, staples, safety pins, nail guns --- all bad ideas. Lots of side effects.

You do want your chinstrap gently applied in such a way that it simply "encourages" your jaw to stay forward. When that happens, your tongue really doesn't have a whole lot of choice other than to help block your airway.

Also, I put the chinstrap on underneath my mask. That way I don't have to take it off when I get up in the night, and it helps to keep the mask put. Some like it the other way around. Try both and see which you are: an "in-ie" or an "out-ie."

Just keep working with it. You'll figure it out.

Post Reply Post Reply
#4
RE: Lip Leak
Blocking the airway into the mouth is a fundamental skill required for using nasal therapy options. Some people can't do it. You can practice controlling the air by using the machine while awake. Get a feel for how to contain the air by keeping the tongue in place. Most of us get good enough at controlling it that we can talk with the pressure on. Your first experience with that will probably produce some interesting sounds. The point is, the better you can master the pressure and make it natural, the more likely the skill will become subconscious allowing you to sleep.
Sleeprider
Apnea Board Moderator
www.ApneaBoard.com

____________________________________________
Download OSCAR Software
Soft Cervical Collar
Optimizing Therapy
Organize your OSCAR Charts
Attaching Files
Mask Primer
How To Deal With Equipment Supplier


INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
Post Reply Post Reply
#5
RE: Lip Leak
I did a google search and came up with surgical tape but I fear pulmonary aspiration could kill me in my sleep even if the tape is applied for easy removal. I may give it a try though, even if I just applied enough to stop the lip flutter.
Post Reply Post Reply
#6
RE: Lip Leak
(02-26-2015, 03:07 PM)Kladeios Wrote: I did a google search and came up with surgical tape but I fear pulmonary aspiration could kill me in my sleep even if the tape is applied for easy removal. I may give it a try though, even if I just applied enough to stop the lip flutter.

Tape = bad idea waiting to happen.

Do as described to master the technique. Often when we put on the chinstraps it actually drives the jaw backwards instead of coaxing it forwards. Perhaps that's what's going on in your case.
Post Reply Post Reply
#7
RE: Lip Leak
First night with moisture resistant surgical tape wasn't too bad. I can still pry my lips apart with the tape so I don't think aspiration would be too much of an issue. It definitely eliminated the lip flutter. I woke up once when there was a small leak but I seemed to sleep a little longer than with the FFM. Let's see how I do on the weekend. I usually have trouble sleeping past 6 am on those days.
Post Reply Post Reply
#8
RE: Lip Leak
The problem is not the leak at the lips. The problem is the leak where your tongue seals against the roof of your mouth. Behind that seal is pressurized air that wants to escape into your mouth. A full face mask raises the pressure in your mouth, eliminating that problem.

Look at your leak graph. If you see extended periods of large leak you know you haven't solved your problem.

If a chin strap doesn't work you can just go back to a full face mask. What's the problem with that option?

I went three years fighting this battle and recently switched to a full face mask. The first one I tried leaked, but not as much as my mouth leaked with the nasal mask. Last week I got a different full face mask and it works great. I finally got my leaks under control. I sleep better. Not great, but better.
Sleepster

INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
Post Reply Post Reply
#9
RE: Lip Leak
I've used the FFM for two months and although I'm comfortable with it, I still feel excessively tired during the day. My AHI ranges from 3-5 but on bad days it sometimes can hit up to 9 (probably because I slept on my back). My first full night with my nasal mask and a bit of surgical tape, had my AHI down around 3.6 and even though I got up around 1:30 and it took me about 10 mins to fall asleep again, I feel more rested than I did with the FFM. I'm hoping this isn't just a fluke. We will see. I need to check the Rescan reports to see what went on.
Post Reply Post Reply
#10
RE: Lip Leak
If you are used to the chin strap, check out the PAPcap. What it does is pull the chin and bottom lip up and encourages the lips to stay together. While at the same time, it also presses against the cheeks and helps to prevent them from filling with air. See my review of it here:
http://www.apneaboard.com/forums/Thread-...-Pur-Sleep

I finally gave up and started trying out FFMs. Yeah, they're a PITA and my AHI is slightly higher with it than with the nasal pillow and chin strap, but I prefer it to the work of putting on everything just to go to bed. We all have a line we are not willing to cross and that was mine I guess.
PaulaO

Take a deep breath and count to zen.




Post Reply Post Reply


Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Mouth leak with new machine LaraM 0 31 5 hours ago
Last Post: LaraM
  Airsense 10 - AHI account for leak rate? FriedRice 9 238 Yesterday, 06:16 AM
Last Post: FriedRice
  AirSense 10 leak rate baseline issue Phil7 6 1,410 03-25-2024, 05:49 AM
Last Post: FriedRice
  Fixed mask leak, but flow limit seems to be increasing AHI emile.leplattenier 3 141 03-19-2024, 11:00 AM
Last Post: staceyburke
  Large leak panic sleepingbetterinFl 3 152 03-19-2024, 07:48 AM
Last Post: sleepingbetterinFl
  Please, need help reading the leak rate and LL info chronic 4 133 03-18-2024, 08:05 AM
Last Post: chronic
  2 weeks in. Mask leak and flow limit Jojo1982 11 672 02-22-2024, 01:51 PM
Last Post: Jojo1982


New Posts   Today's Posts


About Apnea Board

Apnea Board is an educational web site designed to empower Sleep Apnea patients.