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Machine hours
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on the virge Offline

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Posts: 53
Joined: Feb 2015

Machine: PRS 1 (560) Auto with A-Flex
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: P10
Humidifier: Philips Respironics
CPAP Pressure: 7-11
CPAP Software: SleepyHead EncoreBasic Other Software

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Sex: Male
Location: Northern Virginia

Post: #11
RE: Machine hours
My machine is PR System One P560. I got it new. The machine hours are 385.6 and the blower hours are 385.6. My Sleepyhead data are 385.6. There are no "cool-down" hours to be had.
03-13-2015 10:35 AM
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OMyMyOHellYes Offline

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Posts: 915
Joined: Mar 2013

Machine: Respironics 560 Auto
Mask Type: Nasal mask
Mask Make & Model: Resmed Mirage FX
Humidifier: Respironics System One (no heated hose)
CPAP Pressure: 08.0-15.0 cm/H2O
CPAP Software: EncoreBasic

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Texas

Post: #12
RE: Machine hours
(03-13-2015 10:35 AM)on the virge Wrote:  My machine is PR System One P560. I got it new. The machine hours are 385.6 and the blower hours are 385.6. My Sleepyhead data are 385.6. There are no "cool-down" hours to be had.

I bought mine used and it had 0.60 hours (36 minutes) on it.

OMM
03-13-2015 11:23 AM
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Sleeprider Online
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Posts: 3,318
Joined: Dec 2014

Machine: Resmed Aircurve 10 Vauto
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: Resmed Airfit P10
Humidifier: Resmed Climateline
CPAP Pressure: Auto Bilevel 18/9, PS 3
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead EncoreBasic

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Where they make Respironics

Post: #13
RE: Machine hours
(03-13-2015 10:20 AM)me50 Wrote:  
(03-13-2015 08:30 AM)BillMar Wrote:  Everyone,

Thanks for input on my question. I have successfully gone into the clinicians menu following the instructions and am a little less suspicious, but still wonder what has gone on with the machine. It had a very tiny dent on the screen when the tech brought it to my home. (He said it was fine...that he had "bumped" it moving it in the van.) And of late the machine seems to have developed an intermittent "whine" at night when I am using it. (Normally it is very quiet, but the "whine" is quite annoying and seems to be waking me up)

Blower hours are 248 and machine hours are 726. The blower hours corresponds very closely with the amount of time I have used it--about 8 hours daily for 30 days. The machine hours suggest about 90 days of usage. So it would seem the machine has had some use with others. Who knows maybe with someone would could not adapt to CPAP therapy. (I can't imagine why anyone would give up CPAP. It is really life changing. I feel better than I have in years even though my AHI is only averaging 4.31).

In one sense the prior use does not bother me, but I am concerned because my understanding from reading posts on the Board is that Medicare will not provide a replacement for 5 years, and the supplier said the equipment has a guarantee of 2 yrs. So I am exposed for that "gap" if there is a failure. So I want to make sure I have not gotten a recycled "lemon" that is going to go bad sooner than it should.

BillMar

I called Resmed about the difference in hours on my machine (blower vs machine hours) and I was told by the technical support staff that every time you turn your machine off, it continues to run for at least an hour to cool down.

While I am still skeptical, Resmed wasn't the one that was going to lose anything by telling me this and I did put my hand to the hose and did feel a very slight air flow.

I would think that if your machine breaks and it costs more to repair it after it is out of warranty, that your insurance company would help you get another one since it is life threatening not to have treatment. I don't know b/c insurance companies and the medical field is now so upside down that it is difficult to get good care now.

What a bunch of BS. Prove them wrong by recording both blower hours and machine hours, then compare the difference again after a couple nights. If the gap is increasing, they are correct. If not, you caught a manufacturer's rep in a bold faced lie. Use that as part of your leverage for a new machine.

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03-13-2015 11:45 AM
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archangle Offline
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Posts: 3,159
Joined: Feb 2012

Machine: ResMed S9 AutoSet
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: ResMed Swift FX
Humidifier: ResMed S9 H5i
CPAP Pressure: 16-20
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead EncoreBasic

Other Comments: Happy PAPper

Sex: Undisclosed
Location: USA

Post: #14
RE: Machine hours
Most of the time, insurance requires that you rent to own for a CPAP machine. If so, you don't have a right to a new unit as a rental machine. Do you expect the DME to throw away all the rental machines that come back after a month or two when the patient gives up? Don't forget that a fair percent of the new CPAP users quit.

Get the free SleepyHead software here.
Useful links.
Click here for information on the main alternative to CPAP.
If it's midnight and a DME tells you it's dark outside, go and check it yourself.
03-13-2015 04:39 PM
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BillMar Offline

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Posts: 11
Joined: Mar 2015

Machine: Phillips REMstar Auto A-Flex Model 560
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: ResMed Swift FX
Humidifier: Phillips System One Heated Humidifier
CPAP Pressure: 8
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: New Jersey

Post: #15
RE: Machine hours
Archangle,
I understand your point, and can understand the DME's interests. I guess what I would expect is that they would use the recycled machines on all new CPAP patients until they are confirmed users-say at the 90 days which Medicare seems to require, and then substitute a "new out of the box" machine for the continuing customers, as I fully expect to be.

In that way I would have the full manufacturer's time guarantee, and not be looking at usage on the machine by others that I have to fit in my 5 year time frame for another new machine covered by Medicare.

It seems to me 5 years is a long time for a machine getting 8 hours a day of usage to last--14000+ hours. But who knows I am very new at this. Maybe they do last this long. And as I have seen in other posts I may have to buy my own if it fails or the technology undergoes significant improvement during the period.

I can't imagine going back to living without CPAP even for a few weeks while something gets repaired or debated with the supplier.

BillMar

(03-13-2015 04:39 PM)archangle Wrote:  Most of the time, insurance requires that you rent to own for a CPAP machine. If so, you don't have a right to a new unit as a rental machine. Do you expect the DME to throw away all the rental machines that come back after a month or two when the patient gives up? Don't forget that a fair percent of the new CPAP users quit.
03-13-2015 05:09 PM
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eseedhouse Online

Advisory Members

Posts: 878
Joined: Dec 2014

Machine: ResMed Airsense 10 Autoset
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: SimPlus
Humidifier: ResMed
CPAP Pressure: 7-10
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

Other Comments: Also on supplemental O2 at 3L/min. while sleeping.

Sex: Male
Location: Victoria, British Columbia

Post: #16
RE: Machine hours
(03-13-2015 05:09 PM)BillMar Wrote:  Archangle,
I understand your point, and can understand the DME's interests. I guess what I would expect is that they would use the recycled machines on all new CPAP patients until they are confirmed users-say at the 90 days which Medicare seems to require, and then substitute a "new out of the box" machine for the continuing customers, as I fully expect to be.

This does not seem like a sustainable business plan unless the DME can guarantee new customers at a rate that will pay for the slightly used machines as well as the ones they end up with.

Doesn't sound like a way to break even to me, let alone return a profit.

Ed Seedhouse
VA7SDH

I am neither a Doctor, nor any other kind of medical professional.

Actually you know, it is what it isn't.
03-13-2015 05:19 PM
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Sleeprider Online
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Advisory Members

Posts: 3,318
Joined: Dec 2014

Machine: Resmed Aircurve 10 Vauto
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: Resmed Airfit P10
Humidifier: Resmed Climateline
CPAP Pressure: Auto Bilevel 18/9, PS 3
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead EncoreBasic

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Where they make Respironics

Post: #17
RE: Machine hours
I think the point is, most of us would rather have a tooth extraction than deal with a conventional DME. We know what they do, what they charge, and how they make multiple profits off machines. These are the guys who will sell you a CPAP with integrated humidifier, and charge you separately for the machine, humidifier, humidifier chamber, hose, mask, headgear, cushions, filters, etc.

This is not a group of people with a lot of sympathy for these businesses, reselling used equipment at the price of new.

______________________________________________
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Robysue's Beginner's Guide to Sleepyhead
03-13-2015 05:37 PM
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eseedhouse Online

Advisory Members

Posts: 878
Joined: Dec 2014

Machine: ResMed Airsense 10 Autoset
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: SimPlus
Humidifier: ResMed
CPAP Pressure: 7-10
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

Other Comments: Also on supplemental O2 at 3L/min. while sleeping.

Sex: Male
Location: Victoria, British Columbia

Post: #18
RE: Machine hours
(03-13-2015 05:37 PM)Sleeprider Wrote:  I think the point is, most of us would rather have a tooth extraction than deal with a conventional DME. We know what they do, what they charge, and how they make multiple profits off machines. These are the guys who will sell you a CPAP with integrated humidifier, and charge you separately for the machine, humidifier, humidifier chamber, hose, mask, headgear, cushions, filters, etc.

This is not a group of people with a lot of sympathy for these businesses, reselling used equipment at the price of new.

I agree they shouldn't sell a "slightly used" machine as a "new" machine. I would think this could be a dangerous practice and be risky to the business - lawyers buy CPAP machines, you know.

On the other hand I don't think it's a good idea to think that a few bad DME suppliers means they are *all* bad ones. And just because a DME supplier for one brand in one city are bad it doesn't mean a DME supplier for the same brand in another city will be.

So long as they tell you the machine they are selling is "slightly used" and offer people a reasonable discount I have no objection.

If on the other hand you have strong evidence that a supplier is definitely selling a used machine as new then I think you should maybe talk to a lawyer if you can't get them to deal with you reasonably.

Ed Seedhouse
VA7SDH

I am neither a Doctor, nor any other kind of medical professional.

Actually you know, it is what it isn't.
03-13-2015 06:22 PM
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Sleeprider Online
Wiki Editor
Advisory Members

Posts: 3,318
Joined: Dec 2014

Machine: Resmed Aircurve 10 Vauto
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: Resmed Airfit P10
Humidifier: Resmed Climateline
CPAP Pressure: Auto Bilevel 18/9, PS 3
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead EncoreBasic

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Where they make Respironics

Post: #19
RE: Machine hours
Oh-jeezI wouldn't have pushed it except for the rep who fed the totally B.S. line that the machine keeps running to cool down. Oh-jeez

Seriously, it's one thing to deceive, and completely another to treat me like I'm stupid. Huhsign

______________________________________________
Organize your SleepyHead Data
Post your SleepyHead Data from Imgur
Robysue's Beginner's Guide to Sleepyhead
03-13-2015 07:37 PM
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archangle Offline
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Advisory Members

Posts: 3,159
Joined: Feb 2012

Machine: ResMed S9 AutoSet
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: ResMed Swift FX
Humidifier: ResMed S9 H5i
CPAP Pressure: 16-20
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead EncoreBasic

Other Comments: Happy PAPper

Sex: Undisclosed
Location: USA

Post: #20
RE: Machine hours
(03-13-2015 07:37 PM)Sleeprider Wrote:  Oh-jeezI wouldn't have pushed it except for the rep who fed the totally B.S. line that the machine keeps running to cool down. Oh-jeez

Just to be clear for those reading, the ResMed machines do blow for a humidifier cool down period. PRS1 machines don't.

Get the free SleepyHead software here.
Useful links.
Click here for information on the main alternative to CPAP.
If it's midnight and a DME tells you it's dark outside, go and check it yourself.
03-13-2015 11:31 PM
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