08-30-2016, 03:27 AM
(This post was last modified: 08-30-2016, 03:28 AM by Lanco.)
OK, I finally broke down and bought a chin strap to see if it would improve my situation. Got a Ruby adjustable for $12 on ebay. I thought at that price what do I have to lose, even though I tried one about 16 years ago for I assume a few days. Don't remember the details from that long ago but i'm sure it either didn't work and/or I hated it.
So, tonight I just try it on and notice it is really quite tight and not all that comfortable the way I had it set and I noticed I could easily blow air through my lips. So, I am not going to wear it tonight because I can't figure out what good it could do if in the end you can still blow air through your lips.
Am I missing something here? What's the in's and out's of using this mini torture device?
What is rate of success for chin strap. From my experience and yours it
seems to not be very effective. So i am waiting to get full mask. Right now
i get 4 hours sleep then wake up. But it has to be better then my 45 AHI.
Let me know how you do, I hope one of us will have success. I will let
you know if i do. You do the same. Best of luck i think we need some.
I am really concerned about my health. I am afraid the lack of sleep will
lead to Alzheimer disease. Lack of oxygen to brain kills brain cells.
I am using a ResMed Chin Restraint with a ResMed Mirage Activa LT nasal mask. The chin strap is under the lip of the cushion which helps to hold it in place. under my bottom lip. I have tried other skimpier masks that leaked like a sieve and the chin strap was worthless. Unless you plan to use a full face mask, I guess you will need to experiment. BTW my top pressure is 15.0 so there is some counterbalance in the cushion itself.
Best of luck.
"The object in life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane." -- Marcus Aurelius
09-01-2016, 12:11 AM
(This post was last modified: 09-01-2016, 12:15 AM by SaldusMiegas.)
Is it possible you have put the chin strap on wrong?
If you have the same adjustable ruby I have, it is very easy to put it on the wrong way. It will slide on easy but once on it won't be comfortable nor useful.
It is so common that mine came with an insert showing wrong way and right way to wear it.
The strap will have five openings. Two are triangular and three are circular. Nobody would stick their head thru the triangular openings so let's talk about the circular openings.
Will describe them by the strips of neoprene that comprise the circles
There are three:
1. Thick strip with Velcro closure
2. Thin strip with Velcro closure
3. Thick strip with sewn seam
It is natural to put your face thru the largest circle but that is the wrong way to wear it
You actually want to put your face thru the middle sized circle, with your chin resting on the sewn seam and the thick Velcro sliding over top of your head and pull it down behind your head. I actually start with the thick Velcro at the back of my crown then pull the sewn seam down over my face until it cradles my chin. Then pull the back down to the base of my skull which will position the thin Velcro on top of my head.
Once in position, the small circle is around the crown, the medium circle is around my neck, and the large circle frames my face.
So the properly seated chin strap has:
Thin Velcro on top of the head
Thick Velcro behind the head
Sewn seam cradling the chin
In that position the chin strap will seat comfortably and will properly hold the chin in place.
It seems counterintuitive to put it on this way, but once you seat it properly you will instantly know it.
Look closely at the picture of the product on Amazon. It is properly fitted on a mannequin head.
Note that the chin strap is not intended to tie your mouth shut tightly. All it needs to do is gently keep your jaw from falling open. Too tight will give you a headache or cause TMJ pain when you wake up in the morning.
When you close your mouth press your tongue to the roof of your mouth behind your teeth and sort of suck the air out so your tongue makes kind of a seal with the roof of your mouth. Once you have that seal relax your mouth and it will stay that way until you open your mouth. This is best position to prevent air from blowing out through your lips.
I am a natural mouth breather and I successfully use the ruby chin strap with the P-10 nasal pillows. It's comfortable, lowest air pressure, and has minimal air leakage. Wouldn't want to sleep with any other configuration I have tried so far.
I too use a ResMed Chin Restraint, and have for several years. It took some time to get used to wearing it but eventually you won't sleep without it.
I also found that after some time I was able to sleep without using it and had no leaks. During that time I had to use it a few times to correct my mouth breathing and relearn to keep my mouth shut. Some people say that's impossible for me anyway.
Keep trying different chin straps and don't give up.
I just realized I'm more in demand and very valuable....I'm an antique!!
09-08-2016, 12:36 AM
(This post was last modified: 09-08-2016, 12:38 AM by Lanco.)
Thank you for the input.
Saldus Miegas I thank you for all the effort you put into this post. I finally tried it the other night. It took awhile before I did try it because it felt too tight on my head and actually pushes my chin back and I could feel my tongue go back and give me less room to breathe.
Which brings up a point I saw on Supplier #1
website: " In some people, the Ruby-Style Adjustable Chinstrap design can push the jaw backwards which may inadvertently increase the severity of sleep apnea."
OK after a few days of trying on the strap during the day and adjusting it and readjusting it I got it to the point I thought it should be set and thought I'd try it out.
First I'd say it felt kind of scratchy on my face, but then again I didn't shave for a day or two.
But the strange thing is while it kept the pressure down (actually to where it always is except for when I get a leak from the mask or mouth, but my AHI went up to 4.0 with 24 hypopnea's. My average AHI is 2.2. So it didn't help but made it worse. Hey, if something weird is going to happen, guess who it's going to happen to.
I also tried some other things to reduce my AHI but I thought it best to start a new thread on this.
Lanco--My understanding is that a chinstrap is not to forcibly prohibit one from opening one's mouth against it. Its purpose, I was told, is to provide a certain amount of jaw muscle resistance to train the brain to not open the mouth. It's supposed to be a brain training device.
(Being a diehard mouth breather, chinstraps never worked for me)
My experience: Chin straps are horrible!!!
Initially, wearing one didn't seem so bad (I wore it about a week or so), then one morning, after wearing the strap all night, I experienced a TMJ problem that was so severe that I had to stop using it for a week. After about two weeks, my jaw problem went away, but I vowed not to return to any chin strap ever again.
What do I do now:
I am a side-sleeper who rarely moves during the night, and I like to fall asleep hugging my rectangular pillow (it's about 2 feet long). I hold it just below my chin. Now the issue of my mouth dropping open in the middle of the night (common for most of us) is held in check by the placement of the pillow. Works for me!
09-09-2016, 02:14 PM
(This post was last modified: 09-09-2016, 02:54 PM by FrankNichols.)
This is a DIY chin strap by a sleep doctor which should solve many of the issues with commercial straps. This makes sense to me, and I have been meaning to make one, but just haven't gotten around to it. It is a goal for this weekend.
Edit: I just ordered some velcro to make this. Since it seems to be the main thing about his idea is to have non-stretchy velcro so it doesn't stretch when you try to open your mouth, and the reason for the baseball cap is an "easy" way to make a skull cap cheap, I have decided to try making one out of all velcro with no baseball cap (I have never owned a baseball cap, I don't wear hats
). My idea is to use 1 1/2 in double sided velcro and loop it around my skull from the forehead around just above the ears - or maybe even over the ears. 1 1/2 inches gives me lots of velcro to attach too. Then another strip to run under my chin and over my head attaching to the "skull loop" as it goes by to attach to itself on the top of my head. If is doesn't work I can always run to Walmart and grab a cap to multilane
Oh, and anyone interested in 1 1/2 inch double sided velcro I got it from Amazon (Prime - free shipping), it is $17.50 for 30 feet or $12.98 for 45 feet - yeah, always check it is $4.50 less for 45 feet instead of just 30 feet. lol. I figure for $13 for 45 feet I will find uses for this stuff around the computers and things.
I am not a Medical professional and I don't play one on the internet.
Started CPAP Therapy April 5, 2016
I'd Rather Be Sleeping
(09-09-2016, 02:14 PM)FrankNichols Wrote: This is a DIY chin strap by a sleep doctor which should solve many of the issues with commercial straps. This makes sense to me, and I have been meaning to make one, but just haven't gotten around to it. It is a goal for this weekend.
Great link, Frank. I will have to try that. I have more ball caps than a person should have, although a scull cap may work as well. It looks like it is based on the PapCap, which I'm sure has stretchy material for the chin strap portion rather than the non stretchy. I have been considering trying a PapCap.
If you use a ball cap, be sure to use a cap with a velcro adjustment strap or no adjustment strap at all. The ones with the plastic tabs could make your head sore if you roll over onto your back. Also be sure to remove the button on top of the cap if it has one. It hides where the sections come together and could make the top of your head sore if it gets against something.
surferdude2's adaptation could be easily added also.
"....respiration,—a troublesome practice, but one which custom has rendered necessary to our easy existence...." Oliver Twist, Charles Dickens- 1837
I use FlashPAP to load data from a FlashAir III wifi sd card in my machine to my computer and display it with SleepyHead .
robysue's Beginner's Guide to SleepyHead