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Newby question re rainout
#1
Question 
G'day all. I've been searching through the threads trying to find an answer to my query - have learnt lots! But still unsure of exactly why I'm having problems with rainout, so thought it best to ask directly.

I've been trialling a F&P Icon Auto with the heated ThermoSmart Breathing Tube & a Lady Zest Q nasal mask, and have been having issues with rainout. Machine is on auto with pressure range of 7 to 20, machine is situated below sleeping head height, & hose wraps up & over headboard.

On the first night the Humidity level was set to 4 (the default setting) - horrible rainout work me in the early hours of the morning. There were droplets right thoughout the tubing.

I was surprised as I thought the heated tubing would largely prevent rainout. Also, I live in a sub-tropical clime so the evenings are not overly chilly, at the moment they're about 16oC (60oF). Anyway on the 2nd night I dialled the humidity back to 3, same problem with rainout occured. Last night I dropped back to a setting of 1 and finally slept through without rainout waking me out.

My only concern now is that come winter I am going to have to raise the humidity level & worry that this will cause massive rainout again. Any thoughts on this?

Initially I had thought to get a tube cosy but I've learnt from this very informative site that that's a no-no!

Might just be paranoia, but I'm surprised how warm the water chamber gets, even on such low settings. I came home early from work today & realised I hadn't emptied the chamber out (naughty I know), so removed it from the machine and you know what, it was warm to the touch! Could it be that this new machine has a faulty thermostat in it? Any suggestions welcome! Any F&P owners out there had any hassles like this?

Thanks folks, look forward to learning lots from everyone.
Helen
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#2
Hi HBH

Welcome...

Have you tried reducing the humidity setting? If you are getting rain-out then the setting is higher than it needs to be.

I have been using CPAP for about 4 months now and one of the issues I had at the start was the humidity setting.

I started low and worked up until I stopped having dry mouth.

I use a Philips Respironics machine so my numbers wont mean anything to you but on a scale of 1 to 5 I started at two - worked up to 5 then back to 3 or 4 depending..
I have noticed that the amount of water that is used each night varies by about 2 to 1 depending on the weather.


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#3
Thanks Moriarty. Yep last night I dropped the machine down to the lowest humidity setting & avoided rainout, yay! However I worry that in winter, when I will probably need to boost the humidity back up, that the problem with re-occur. Have you noticed a difference coming out of winter into spring with your settings?
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#4
I'm not sure about the controls on your machine, but on the ResMed S9 machine, you have to select the correct type of tubing, which in my case would be climate line (heated hose vs standard) AND you must select the humidity control to Auto. When in Auto Humidity control, the user selects a temperature, and the machine adjusts the humidity itself to avoid rainout. I suspect that your machine has similar controls, and one of them isn't set correctly thus defeating the anti-rainout feature.

I hope that this helps.

Good luck!
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#5
(11-01-2012, 07:19 AM)HBH Wrote: Have you noticed a difference coming out of winter into spring with your settings?

Hi HBH

I haven't had a great deal of stability in location since I have had the machine. I live in Toowoomba but have spent about half the time in Perth on and off. I have had night time temperatures ranging from around 5 to over 20... but never had rainout. I have a heated tube but only use it on colder nights.

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#6
Hi HBH,
You did the right thing by turning down your humidity; I don't know if you will have to turn it up in the winter but if you do, maybe you could just turn it up one notch and you might not have the problems with rainout.
I have heard that it's a nono to use hose covers with the heated hose but I use one with my machine and don't have any trouble. I think the machine would compensate but if you feel safer not using one, I sure do understand.
Good luck on getting this straightened out.
trish6hundred
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#7
By rainout you mean the gurgling in the hose?

The machine should be lower than the bed, true, but also try to eliminate any loop in the hose where water collects. That's difficult to do but not totally impossible.

I have a S9 with heated hose and my machine sits slightly higher than my head. The heated hose has completely eliminated rainout so it no longer matters.

A lot of people don't bother with the humidifier. I only use mine during the winter because my US Southern summers are quite humid.

First, try turning the humidity setting up one notch at a time. Leave it for several nights then turn up another notch. Repeat until you get the rainout again.

Second, consider getting another machine. There's a few people here with the Icon and they have trouble with the software. I *think* the Icon is not compatible with the Sleepyhead software which is free. The Resmed S9 Autoset and the Respironics Auto are popular. They both work with SleepyHead. The Resmed also has ResScan which is also free.

PaulaO2
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www.ApneaBoard.com


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#8
(11-01-2012, 06:57 AM)HBH Wrote: I came home early from work today & realised I hadn't emptied the chamber out (naughty I know), so removed it from the machine and you know what, it was warm to the touch! Could it be that this new machine has a faulty thermostat in it? Any suggestions welcome! Any F&P owners out there had any hassles like this?

Thanks folks, look forward to learning lots from everyone.
Helen
its normal for the plate to feel warm in standby mode .... you can unplug the machine when not being used

misting in the mask or in the hose part close to mask is not rainout .. more likely from your breath

F&P don,t recommend to cover or place ThermoSmart under bed covers
make sure you don,t fill the chamber above the max line and the electrical connectors of ThermoSmart and the elbow attached properly

the Icon clinical manual available via Email (section three)
http://www.apneaboard.com/adjust-cpap-pr...tup-manual

Icon setup video
http://vimeo.com/20560260
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