Post Reply 
[News] Take a pill instead of CPAP?
Author Message
ApneaNews Offline
Apnea News Correspondent
Advisory Members

Posts: 170
Joined: Feb 2012

Machine: IBM Selectric II
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: 3M N95 (it gets dusty in the newsroom)
Humidifier: Sears Kenmore (circa 1979)
CPAP Pressure: 3200 psi
CPAP Software: Other Software

Other Comments: I report, therefore I am.

Sex: Undisclosed
Location: In the newsroom (where else?)

Post: #1
Take a pill instead of CPAP?
Sleeping Angels
How children's sleep affects their health and well being.
by Dennis Rosen, M.D.


Medicine Instead Of CPAP For Obstructive Sleep Apnea?

Study offers hope for new treatment of common nighttime breathing disorder

Does the prospect of having to wear CPAP each night, every night, for the foreseeable future keep you from sleeping? A new study holds out the promise of one day being able to treat obstructive sleep apnea with a pill, instead of CPAP.

Obstructive sleep apnea, a condition in which the muscles of the throat relax to the point that the throat actually collapses, blocking airflow to the lungs, and resulting in dozens, even hundreds of awakenings at night, is a condition from which millions of Americans suffer.

As anyone who has ever carried a sleeping child to his bed well knows, muscle relaxation is part of sleep. What is less commonly appreciated, however, is that this relaxation is especially prominent in a stage of sleep known as REM (rapid eye movement) sleep. In REM, we lose muscle tone in almost all of our muscles, except for our eye muscles (hence its name) and our diaphragm, the largest muscle involved in breathing. On the one hand, this is a good thing: if not, we’d be running into walls and tripping over night tables as we acted out our dreams. On the other hand, this loss of muscle tone extends to the muscles of our throat, making them more prone to collapse, and making us especially prone to OSA during this sleep state, which comprises 25 percent of sleep.

Researchers at the University of Toronto reported this week that they have identified the main mechanism responsible for the relaxation of the throat muscles in REM sleep, as well as a way to medically reverse it (in rats, not in humans, though it is likely to be very similar in both species). This is great news, as millions of people struggle nightly with CPAP, a machine that blows air into their throat, so that they can breathe (and sleep) comfortably at night.

Many people with obstructive sleep apnea dislike, and therefore don’t use, CPAP. Those who forgo treating their obstructive sleep apnea have to deal not only with being chronically sleepy, but also with increased risk of heart disease, diabetes, and high blood pressure. This discovery is terrifically important, as it holds out the promise that it may be possible, within a few years, to treat obstructive sleep apnea with a pill instead of CPAP.

fair use from:
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/slee...leep-apnea

The above post may contain copyrighted material the use of which has not always been specifically authorized by the copyright owner. The material available is intended to advance the understanding of Sleep Apnea treatment and to advance the educational level of Sleep Apnea patients with regard to their health. Sometimes included is the full text of articles and documents rather than a simple link because outside links frequently "go bad" or change over time. This constitutes a "fair use" of any such copyrighted material as provided for in section 107 of the US Copyright Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, the material in this post is distributed without fee or payment of any kind for research and educational purposes. If you wish to use copyrighted material from this post for purposes of your own that go beyond "fair use", you must obtain permission from the copyright owner.
02-21-2013 09:22 AM
Find all posts by this user Post Reply Quote this message in a reply

Donate to Apnea Board
DocWils Offline

Members-b

Posts: 1,271
Joined: Jul 2012

Machine: Philips Remstar series 60
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: ResMed P10
Humidifier: same as machine
CPAP Pressure: 5-15
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Switzerland

Post: #2
RE: Take a pill instead of CPAP?
Yeah, don't hold your breath about this - even after rat trials, it still will have to work in humans and prove non-toxic over a long period of time. If you have a choice between taking a pill every night for the rest of your life and possibly building up a damaged liver and using a CPAP with no side effects then which would you choose? Either way, if this pill got approved for human trials tomorrow, you are still talking about ten years before it will be cleared as safe.
02-21-2013 04:58 PM
Find all posts by this user Post Reply Quote this message in a reply
britincanada Offline

Preferred Members-2

Posts: 81
Joined: Aug 2012

Machine: Respironics BiBpapautoSV Advanced
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model:
Humidifier: unsure
CPAP Pressure: unsure
CPAP Software: Not using software

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Canada

Post: #3
RE: Take a pill instead of CPAP?
Now if there was a fix for the centrals too i would wait Ten years

right now my Mask is driving me nuts USA replacement every 3 mths here in Canada a new mask Once a Year

We Breath differently here in Canada it would seem oh well only 7 mth left before i can get a new one or pay out of pocket
02-21-2013 05:59 PM
Find all posts by this user Post Reply Quote this message in a reply

Donate to Apnea Board
Shastzi Offline

Advisory Members

Posts: 1,174
Joined: Dec 2012

Machine: ResMed S9 Autoset
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: FitLife Total face mask
Humidifier: F&P HC150 with Hybernite heated hose.
CPAP Pressure: 15cm-20cm H2O (auto)
CPAP Software: SleepyHead Other Software

Other Comments: CMS50-F wearable Oximeter; Software: SPO2 Assistant

Sex: Undisclosed
Location: Florida, USA.

Post: #4
RE: Take a pill instead of CPAP?
I am on quite a few drugs right now as it is. I wonder what side effects the rats were having?

"With ordinary talent and extraordinary perseverance, all things are attainable." - Thomas Foxwell Buxton

Cool
02-21-2013 08:04 PM
Find all posts by this user Post Reply Quote this message in a reply
Allen Offline

Preferred Members-2

Posts: 96
Joined: Sep 2012

Machine: ResMed S9 Autoset
Mask Type: Nasal mask
Mask Make & Model: ResMed Mirage FX with SeaTec chin strap
Humidifier: ResMed H5i
CPAP Pressure: 8.0 to 18.0
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Post: #5
RE: Take a pill instead of CPAP?
I'd be very happy if they bring out a pill that works for apnea as long as the side effects were minimal
(This post was last modified: 02-21-2013 08:20 PM by Allen.)
02-21-2013 08:19 PM
Find all posts by this user Post Reply Quote this message in a reply

Donate to Apnea Board
Sleepster Offline
Wiki Editor
Moderators

Posts: 4,995
Joined: Feb 2012

Machine: ResMed AirCurve10 VAuto
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: F&P Simplus
Humidifier: HumidAir and SlimLine Hose
CPAP Pressure: MaxI 13.6 | MinE 5.2 | PS 4.4
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments: Diagnosed Nov 2011. Conquered aerophagia.

Sex: Male
Location: Houston, Texas

Post: #6
RE: Take a pill instead of CPAP?
By the time that pill comes out I'll be so used to sleeping with a CPAP machine that I won't know how to sleep without it!

Sleepster
Apnea Board Moderator
www.ApneaBoard.com


INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
02-21-2013 09:19 PM
Find all posts by this user Post Reply Quote this message in a reply
DocWils Offline

Members-b

Posts: 1,271
Joined: Jul 2012

Machine: Philips Remstar series 60
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: ResMed P10
Humidifier: same as machine
CPAP Pressure: 5-15
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Switzerland

Post: #7
RE: Take a pill instead of CPAP?
My concern is not the immediate side effects but the long term effects on the liver and pancreas. A lot of drugs that people have to take long term can cause eventual toxic effects on the liver, and the judgement is usually that even it wrecks your liver eventually, it still extends your life or quality of life longer than if you weren't on the drugs, so we prescribe them anyway. But it is a calculated risk that in some cases we are only now beginning to see the outcome of, given that many of the long term pills that are now commonly prescribed are only 30 or 40 years old, and we are only now getting to see the toxic effects of long term use. The real exception to that is Aspirin in low dose form - here we have masses of data accumulated, and it all shows a strong positive effect, but new drugs take years to show up problems like those I mentioned.

Hence my feeling that if you had a choice between a pill and possible liver cancer 30 years or less down the road, or a CPAP and no cancer, then I'd take the CPAP, despite my being passed middle age (unless you know people who make it to 115 years of age).

Incidentally, we don't really know exactly how much negative effect long term use of CPAPs may have, given the amount of air forced into the system. No one has done mortality studies on that yet. However, the long term positive effects are known, in comparison to not using the therapy and still having a middle to high AHI.
02-21-2013 09:34 PM
Find all posts by this user Post Reply Quote this message in a reply

Donate to Apnea Board
archangle Online
Wiki Editor
Advisory Members

Posts: 3,163
Joined: Feb 2012

Machine: ResMed S9 AutoSet
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: ResMed Swift FX
Humidifier: ResMed S9 H5i
CPAP Pressure: 16-20
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead EncoreBasic

Other Comments: Happy PAPper

Sex: Undisclosed
Location: USA

Post: #8
RE: Take a pill instead of CPAP?
Is there something in particular about this drug vs. the liver and pancreas, or are you just talking about the general effect of daily drugs?

I always say that long term CPAP causes aging.

In the same sense that drunk driving prevents aging.

Get the free SleepyHead software here.
Useful links.
Click here for information on the main alternative to CPAP.
If it's midnight and a DME tells you it's dark outside, go and check it yourself.
02-22-2013 01:50 AM
Find all posts by this user Post Reply Quote this message in a reply
DocWils Offline

Members-b

Posts: 1,271
Joined: Jul 2012

Machine: Philips Remstar series 60
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: ResMed P10
Humidifier: same as machine
CPAP Pressure: 5-15
CPAP Software: SleepyHead

Other Comments:

Sex: Male
Location: Switzerland

Post: #9
RE: Take a pill instead of CPAP?
I am concerned about long term effects of any drug - there is ample evidence that the bulk of the drugs we have to take daily for lots of conditions eventually damage the liver, pancreas or kidneys, either through slow erosion or toxic build-up. The calculation is that it is either the pill and a later death due to organ failure of one sort or another, or don't take the pill and have an early death because to the effects of the disease or condition that would necessitate the pill in the first place. It is usually in the literature of most of the drugs, but we tend not to talk about it to patients very much, because it is a risk calculation that is necessary (and there is no 100% chance that you would develop toxicity from the pill, just a high enough chance as to make it worth thinking about). The exception's when we are talking to younger people about some long term pill or other - there we do outline the risk, because they likely have a long enough life to encounter the toxic effects at a younger age than, say, someone at 50 first going on some of those pills, given that it may take 30 to 40 years for the toxic effects to show. And we figure that 80 is a good run in most cases.

So here we have something that may not show for 30 years and may kill you (or not, the lab work for that won't be in for 30 years) or we have something that has no noticeable side effects (although the air swallowing may cause erosion of the stomach or intestines or may encourage diverticulitis, and of course, there is a slight cancer risk with the increase of air intake, but nothing like it would be one O2 alone) and is safe for extreme long term use. Which do you choose? Which should a physician recommend?
(This post was last modified: 02-22-2013 06:39 AM by DocWils.)
02-22-2013 06:39 AM
Find all posts by this user Post Reply Quote this message in a reply

Donate to Apnea Board
dcgrafix Offline

Preferred Members-2

Posts: 203
Joined: Sep 2012

Machine: Philips Respironics System One RemStar Pro with C-Flex+ (461CA)
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: ResMed Mirage Quattro Large
Humidifier: Respironics System one
CPAP Pressure: 8
CPAP Software: SleepyHead EncoreBasic Other Software

Other Comments: Diabetes type 2

Sex: Male
Location: BC Canada

Post: #10
RE: Take a pill instead of CPAP?
(02-21-2013 05:59 PM)britincanada Wrote:  Now if there was a fix for the centrals too i would wait Ten years

right now my Mask is driving me nuts USA replacement every 3 mths here in Canada a new mask Once a Year

We Breath differently here in Canada it would seem oh well only 7 mth left before i can get a new one or pay out of pocket

Yes & we Canadians were always told that we have a better medical system than the US but I must be missing something because my medical told me that they only pay for 1 mask total after that too bad so sad.
My mask is leaking all the time now & last night I had over 61 mins in total leak.
The problem with medical plans like any insurance is the want to pay the very least but cant see the bigger picture by not doing the proper thing in the beginning will eventually end up costing the medical system way more in the end when a CPAP users leaking mask may be the cause of a bad car accident involving multiple expensive medical costs not to mention death & destroyed families that could have been saved by a mask that costs less than $200.00.

I could Rant about this all night but I need to get more sleep.

I think medical insurance & any other type of insurance companies are not much different then Casinos, they would be there if they weren't able to make millions from us & make it hard as hell to get benefit payments.

At least Casinos offer entertainment & higher oxygen levels I could use some of that Oxygen that is.
(This post was last modified: 02-23-2013 03:50 AM by dcgrafix.)
02-23-2013 03:46 AM
Find all posts by this user Post Reply Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 


Possibly Related Threads...
Thread: Author Replies: Views: Last Post
  [Diagnosis] Could Sleeping Pill During Test Cause False Apnea Diagnosis Violetskyye 20 1,057 09-23-2016 03:22 PM
Last Post: Sleeprider
  [News] Will That Sleeping Pill Give You A Heart Attack Or Cancer? ApneaNews 0 1,602 03-24-2012 08:03 PM
Last Post: ApneaNews

Forum Jump:

Who's Online (Complete List)