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ResMed F20 mask magnets & pacemakers
#11
Thank you srlevine1. I will definitely check out the resources you cite. Your idea of replacing the magnetic closure using "velcro dots" is intriguing. Unless there is some sound information from credible sources in the interim, I'll look into the velcro idea during my next DME visit. Thanks again.
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#12
My wife has a pacemaker, If (currently a big IF) I where to use the F20 I would NOT feel comfortable wearing it in bed next to her. Cuddle a little wrong and potentially cause an issue, no thanks. I appreciate ResMed innovating a new system but would really appreciate an alternate set straps/headgear that would completely avoid the issue.

We have had many major issues and luckily come out on the good side (she is still here) at least 5 of them could have easily gone the other way. This one will NOT be an issue, sorry ResMed but I cannot consider using your F20 in it's current configuration.

And yes I agree the medical warnings are conservative.

Fred
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#13
I am curious. Aren't we talking about stray magnetic fields? When the magnetic clip on the mask is attached, the only magnetic fields that would affect nearby items would be the stray magnetic fields not the full magnetic strength of the magnets in question unless both sides of the clip are magnets. Of course if the magnets became detached during the night and started flopping around, that would be a different matter. Any way you look at it, in your situation, I would not use a mask with magnetic clips unless they were positioned further away with less chance of moving closer.

Best Regards,

PaytonA

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#14
SRLevine -- Did you ever try the Velcro option?
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#15
Those magnets would have to be a strong to withstand the strap pull forces as well as twisting and turns involved as the wearer shifts positions during the night. Or am I missing something here in my reading of the Resmed information?
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#16
The strap tension is held mechanically by a lip around the magnet. The magnet just maintains the lip in the correct position.

Best Regards,

PaytonA

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#17
(12-31-2016, 05:11 PM)bonjour Wrote: My wife has a pacemaker, If (currently a big IF) I where to use the F20 I would NOT feel comfortable wearing it in bed next to her.  Cuddle a little wrong and potentially cause an issue, no thanks.  I appreciate ResMed innovating a new system but would really appreciate an alternate set straps/headgear that would completely avoid the issue.

We have had many major issues and luckily come out on the good side (she is still here) at least 5 of them could have easily gone the other way.  This one will NOT be an issue, sorry ResMed but I cannot consider using your F20 in it's current configuration.

And yes I agree the medical warnings are conservative.

Fred

Very good common sense response Fred. I'm with you, first things  first.

Stan
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#18
(01-02-2017, 02:23 PM)PaytonA Wrote: I am curious. Aren't we talking about stray magnetic fields? When the magnetic clip on the mask is attached, the only magnetic fields that would affect nearby items would be the stray magnetic fields not the full magnetic strength of the magnets in question unless both sides of the clip are magnets. Of course if the magnets became detached during the night and started flopping around, that would be a different matter. Any way you look at it, in your situation, I would not use a mask with magnetic clips unless they were positioned further away with less chance of moving closer.

Best Regards,

PaytonA

I just tested mine with a non-magnetic blade. both sides of the clips are magnets. I'm not sure this has any bearing on the pacemaker safety issue. I just needed to satisfy my curiosity. Wink

It's the best mask I've used to date by far but I wouldn't wear it if I had the pacemaker.
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#19
Many people regard. a pacemaker of current design to be as susceptible to magnetic fields as the ones of the 1970's.  Current pacemaker designs, at least the ones I'm familiar with. incorporate inert composites and nonmagnetic alloys.  One of the big no-no's used to be getting near a microwave while its in use.  The new units will operate properly even while its in a microwave.  It's akin to comparing a Sopwith Camel to a F-35.  

The second part is mere speculation on my part.  A company like Resmed that is clearly over cautious when it comes to safety would have addressed this concern early on during R&D.
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#20
(12-19-2016, 11:31 PM)srlevine1 Wrote:
(12-19-2016, 02:38 PM)WLKSRQ Wrote: I have an implanted pacemaker/ defibrillator and, as such, need to be careful of coming into close proximity of certain magnetic fields.  I'm otherwise interested in trying the new ResMed F20 mask but I'm hesitant because of its magnetic clips.  I've checked the F20 manual and they suggest keeping at least a 2 inch separation between device and magnet.  Being an active sleeper I can envision myself violating this standard.  So my question is this: Is Resmed's suggestion overly conservative or is there reason for me to stay clear of the F20?  Thanks in advance.

I have an implanted Medtronic Reveal Linq loop recorder and asked Medtronic the same question. They wouldn't comment on any device they have not tested in their laboratory.

It is my understanding that the key issues are: battery discharge, service mode changes, introduction of noise in the sensing circuit, and in the case of pacemaker/defibrillators, accidental or untimely discharge.

So I was wondering if I could replace the magnetic closure using "Velcro dots" which are easily available? Since this is a life-critical issue, I will try the Velcro route or wait until there is some significant information from a trusted and credible source like the manufacturer.

Here are some resources   .

Interference of neodymium magnets with cardiac pacemakers and implantable cardioverter-defibrillators: an in vitro study.

Effects of External Electrical and Magnetic Fields on Pacemakers and Defibrillators: From Engineering Principles to Clinical Practice

Best of luck. Keep us posted if you find a credible answer.

I thought I would take this opportunity to update my post with new information.

My electrophysiologist removed my Medtronic Reveal-Linq loop recorder and replaced it with a Medtronic Defibrillator (AICD) to keep me safer from life-threatening ventricular tachycardia.

I was cautioned about magnet usage because it appears that the magnet affects a magnet switch in the device and can keep the device from firing in addition to placing it in a mode that facilitates information transmission. The large sensor head on the programmer unit used to periodically read the device also contains a magnet that does "flip" the switch.


Quote:My Medtronic implantable defibrillator has a built-in tiny magnet-activated reed switch that is activated whenever a magnet is placed over the device. The presence of a magnetic field near the reed switch causes it to close and tells the device to temporarily suspend tachycardia detection and over-pacing shock therapy. Apparently it does not affect low-level pacing which remains enabled

As long as the magnet is over the device, no shocks will be delivered to respond to ventricular tachycardia or fibrillation.  And once the magnet is removed, the switch opens again restoring the device’s ability to deliver life-saving shocks and pre-pacing.

You can actually purchase, without a prescription, Medtronic loop magnets -- but it appears to me that you are betting against yourself and the device should you choose to use it inappropriately.

The Velcro solution did not work satisfactorily so I returned to my ResMed Mirage Activa LT nasal mask.
"The object in life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane." -- Marcus Aurelius
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