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Should one even care about the FL graph on ASV machine?
#11
RE: Should one even care about the FL graph on ASV machine?
The Flow limitation chart to me, outside of the forced/timed/backup breathing is an indication that flow limitations are occurring and to look deeper while initiating treatment (typically higher pressure support). The detailed view typically shows far more flow limitation than the FL chart. Never chase the flow limits themselves if they are not causing an issue. So what SleepRider said.
Fred Bonjour - Project Manager and Lead Tester for OSCAR - Open Source CPAP Analysis Reporter

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#12
RE: Should one even care about the FL graph on ASV machine?
(10-26-2019, 10:10 AM)Sleeprider Wrote:
(10-26-2019, 09:48 AM)Michaely6 Wrote: Is this also true with the flow rate graph itself on the aircurve Asv as well because some of the breaths on the actual flow rate graph appear to have the characteristics of a flow limited breath as well (non rounded inspiratory curve).

If flow limitation is observed coincident to minimum pressure support, then increased minimum pressure support or higher EPAP min, might be considered to minimize that.  I was mainly talking about those breaths where higher pressure support is doing the work of respiration.

I already maxed out my min PS at 6 so I guess there is nothing I can do regarding that part. I really wish Resmed did not put a limitation to pressure support min on such an expensive device.
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#13
RE: Should one even care about the FL graph on ASV machine?
(10-26-2019, 10:11 AM)bonjour Wrote: The Flow limitation chart to me, outside of the forced/timed/backup breathing is an indication that flow limitations are occurring and to look deeper while initiating treatment (typically higher pressure support).  The detailed view typically shows far more flow limitation than the FL chart.  Never chase the flow limits themselves if they are not causing an issue.  So what SleepRider said.

Can you elaborate on what the detailed view is? Also I already maxed out the PS min at 6 so not much I can do regarding that.
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#14
RE: Should one even care about the FL graph on ASV machine?
View the Flow rate, 3 minutes at a time. This is detailed enough to show the waveform for manual interpretation.
Fred Bonjour - Project Manager and Lead Tester for OSCAR - Open Source CPAP Analysis Reporter

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#15
RE: Should one even care about the FL graph on ASV machine?
(10-26-2019, 12:19 PM)bonjour Wrote: View the Flow rate, 3 minutes at a time.  This is detailed enough to show the waveform for manual interpretation.

OK thanks
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#16
RE: Should one even care about the FL graph on ASV machine?
Sorry there Michaely6. Something not right on the PC and OSCAR screenshot postings. I'm getting a nice blank white screen. After I consider what part to sledgehammer, I might be successful in posting info. I'm on a bronchitis required break for a bit...

BTW my FL was flat zero
Dave

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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEBSITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
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#17
RE: Should one even care about the FL graph on ASV machine?
No worries Dave thanks
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#18
RE: Should one even care about the FL graph on ASV machine?
(10-26-2019, 07:28 PM)SarcasticDave94 Wrote: Sorry there Michaely6. Something not right on the PC and OSCAR screenshot postings. I'm getting a nice blank white screen. After I consider what part to sledgehammer, I might be successful in posting info. I'm on a bronchitis required break for a bit...

BTW my FL was flat zero

Wow FL graph was flat zero on an ASV? That's unheard of...
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#19
RE: Should one even care about the FL graph on ASV machine?
(10-26-2019, 08:47 AM)Michaely6 Wrote: Every FL graph on the aircurve Asv looks so wild and out of control compared to Cpap and Auto Bipap (non asv machine).  

So true!   

Isn't it great!  

This is one of the very best things about the ASV.  

The ASV is far from perfect and is not for everyone but this is for one really awesome aspect of the ASV.

See to me the increased chaos on the flow limit chart is a direct ongoing reminder of how much higher starting EPAP & ongoing EPAP pressure the user would have to suffer through when using most of the other CPAP and BiPAP machines out there.  

Kind of like that line at the bottom of the grocery store receipt that says "This is how much money your discounts saved you today $xxx.xx"

Written mostly based in facts and seasoned with a bit of 'tongue in cheek'

WillSleep

INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
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#20
RE: Should one even care about the FL graph on ASV machine?
Hi Michael, 

To answer your original question.  "Should one even care about the FL graph on ASV machine?"

I think that depends on the User and how much help they need trying to sort out what is going on at a detail level through the nights.   

So people just get great results and don't have a lot of funny events that they need to spend time sorting out.  

Others find the Flow Limit chart valuable.  

(10-26-2019, 10:11 AM)bonjour Wrote: The Flow limitation chart to me, outside of the forced/timed/backup breathing is an indication that flow limitations are occurring and to look deeper while initiating treatment (typically higher pressure support).  The detailed view typically shows far more flow limitation than the FL chart.  Never chase the flow limits themselves if they are not causing an issue.  

First, I really like how Bonjour put it here.  

I will add that I use the FL chart in these ways:
  • As another view of the Flow Rate chart filtered to just show Flow Limits the Flow Limit chart makes OSCAR easier to read and understand without needing to zoom into 3-min segments of time.
  • Sometimes zoomed mid-way or zoomed into 2-3 min segments the Flow Limit chart is the last deciding vote, the final piece of the puzzle that clarifies an ambiguity in the Flow Rate Wave form or is the one single signal that explains why Minute Vent dropped even though Insp/Exp both showed no change, etc.     


//////////////////////


I have not seen the chart your speaking of.  I will just add that on an ASV the more spastic the FL chart looks the more likely Min EPAP would need to raise some in concert with Min or Max PS going up higher to address to beat the flow limits down to more reasonable number. 

Update:  I will add that at least some of the flow limits and even sometimes even some hyponeas you can completely ignore.

If the ECG device like a Dreem 2 or the 5 second updates to your HR and your SpO2 from your Pulse-Ox showed zero change, zero variation then what is reported in OSCAR may not have happened or if the event did happen it was a complete 'non-event' and did not disrupt your sleep in any way.  


WillSleep

INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
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