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Sleep stages - can it be monitored by me?
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MouthBreatha Offline

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Machine: ResMed AirSense 10 Autoset
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Sex: Male
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Post: #1
Sleep stages - can it be monitored by me?
I have an AirSense 10 Autoset and I use the Sleepyhead software. Could anyone tell me if there is a way to tell when I go from one sleep stage to another by that software? Or maybe perhaps some other software?

My numbers look good, but I am not noticing much difference in how tired I feel each day after using. I know my tiredness has something to do with my sleep because on some days I wake up feeling sharp and I do end up having a good day. On other days, I wake up feeling tired and off and its always a bad day. I can tell if it will be a good day or a bad day before I am done my shower which I take immediately upon waking. The good days are few and far in between these days. My allergy issues have been getting worse and so I'm not sure if that is coming into play either.

Oh, and another question - I have been on and off using the CPAP since I started this past May. Whenever I start using it again, should I notice a difference right away, or does it take a few days or more of using it to notice a difference in my quality of sleep? I've never experienced an ahh haa moment and so I am trying to figure out why. So being able to see how I am going in and out of my sleep cycles would be very helpful

Thanks,
Rich
02-18-2016 04:04 PM
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sptrout Offline

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Machine: ResMed AirSense 10
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CPAP Pressure: 8-11
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

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Sex: Male
Location: Spring, TX

Post: #2
RE: Sleep stages - can it be monitored by me?
For monitoring stages of sleep you need to be wired-up to a device that can measure brain waves, like they do in a sleep lab. A CPAP machine can only measure airflow and pressure, which are not sleep stage related. You can be wide awake and your CPAP will not know for sure if you are awake or asleep.

There used to be a great device on the market called a Zeo Sleep Monitor (or Coach as it was also called). I used one every night for about six months and it provided very helpful information on each night's sleep, and also data for long term comparison. (It did not measure, or claim to, anything sleep apnea related.) It did measure brain waves with a headband that contained three sensors. The information collected has transmitted wirelessly to a bedside device where the data could be reviewed locally, or (if desired) sent to the manufacturer's site where much more data was made available. The company went out of business about two years ago and, as of now, there is no product on the market that I have seen that comes even close to providing the detailed data that Zeo did.
02-18-2016 04:21 PM
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MouthBreatha Offline

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Machine: ResMed AirSense 10 Autoset
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: AirFit N10
Humidifier: Unsure
CPAP Pressure: 4-9
CPAP Software: ResScan

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Sex: Male
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Post: #3
RE: Sleep stages - can it be monitored by me?
This? Link deleted. Google Zeo Sleep Manager.

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Moderator Action: Link Removed
To maintain our status as an educational organization, the only commercial links allowed in this forum are to CPAP-related manufacturer websites. This is stated in the Apnea Board Rules with details given in the Commercial Links Policy section.
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02-18-2016 04:25 PM
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MouthBreatha Offline

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Machine: ResMed AirSense 10 Autoset
Mask Type: Full face mask
Mask Make & Model: AirFit N10
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CPAP Pressure: 4-9
CPAP Software: ResScan

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Sex: Male
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Post: #4
RE: Sleep stages - can it be monitored by me?
Oh, and any idea why my numbers are good and I'm still tired in the morning (and rest of day)? I know its sleep related. Do I need to be on CPAP a certain amount of time before I notice its benefits? ~ thanks
02-18-2016 04:30 PM
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sptrout Offline

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Machine: ResMed AirSense 10
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: ResMed, AirFit P10
Humidifier: HumidAir
CPAP Pressure: 8-11
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

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Sex: Male
Location: Spring, TX

Post: #5
RE: Sleep stages - can it be monitored by me?
(02-18-2016 04:25 PM)MouthBreatha Wrote:  This? Link removed

Yep, that's it. However, with the company long gone, the standalone product has only a small percentage of its original capabilities. Most of the user friendly results, and data, was only available when uploading your data into their website. Without the website, the person selling the product is over charging. One reason I never touch e-bay.
02-18-2016 05:54 PM
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sptrout Offline

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Machine: ResMed AirSense 10
Mask Type: Nasal pillows
Mask Make & Model: ResMed, AirFit P10
Humidifier: HumidAir
CPAP Pressure: 8-11
CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

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Sex: Male
Location: Spring, TX

Post: #6
RE: Sleep stages - can it be monitored by me?
(02-18-2016 04:30 PM)MouthBreatha Wrote:  Oh, and any idea why my numbers are good and I'm still tired in the morning (and rest of day)? I know its sleep related. Do I need to be on CPAP a certain amount of time before I notice its benefits? ~ thanks

I have only been on CPAP for less than a year, but from what I have read here and elsewhere, every person has a different response. I did not notice a big difference, but overtime, things have gotten better. Others have reported big changes even on the first try.
02-18-2016 05:59 PM
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PaytonA Offline
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CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

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Post: #7
RE: Sleep stages - can it be monitored by me?
You may never have an Ah Ha moment even though CPAP may have improved everything a lot. For some the improvement is so slow and methodical that you may not notice it unless you are paying really close attention.

For that to take place you must have stuck with it and worked it as best you can. It also helps if you believe it is going to help. Just like anything else.

Best Regards,

PaytonA
02-18-2016 06:52 PM
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Possum Offline

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CPAP Software: ResScan SleepyHead

Other Comments: Innovo CMS-50F+ pulse oximeter

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Location: San Diego, California, USA

Post: #8
RE: Sleep stages - can it be monitored by me?
For me, it went like this: I adjusted quickly and easily and felt better almost instantly, so I had a several-month honeymoon period. Then I started feeling kind of over it and frustrated with sleeping with gear, feeling trapped, etc., like "Am I really going to have to sleep with all of this GEAR for the rest of my life?!" Then I convinced myself that I didn't even feel better, so stopped for a couple of nights and quickly remembered what not getting any quality sleep felt like.

Another thing you could try is purchasing a recording oximeter to determine if the CPAP therapy is keeping your oxygen levels high enough during the night. Some people have to add in supplemental oxygen as well, which is pretty easy to do, as the oxygen line goes directly into the main CPAP hose. Also, I haven't confirmed this, but I believe I can roughly tell when I enter REM sleep with my oximetry data from the increases in pulse rate that seem to occur cyclically throughout the night and last for about 45 minutes. Since you're interested in sleep stages, you might want to have some visibility to those fluctuations that occur.

Here is a scholarly article that supports my hypothesis that REM sleep can be detected through continuous heart rate monitoring (as with a recording pulse oximeter):
http://www.psycho.hes.kyushu-u.ac.jp/~la.../P-205.pdf
(This post was last modified: 02-19-2016 11:00 AM by Possum.)
02-18-2016 07:36 PM
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eseedhouse Offline

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Other Comments: Also on supplemental O2 at 3L/min. while sleeping.

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Location: Victoria, British Columbia

Post: #9
RE: Sleep stages - can it be monitored by me?
I think you mentioned that you had been on and off CPAP - that won't work very well. Use it all the time, if possible, or don't use it at all. Well, there may be the odd emergency that prohibits that, but successful *PAP therapy requires continuous use as much as possible. Consider your machine as part of your pajamas.

Don't forget that the machine may be helping you even if you don't feel better. It may be preventing you from getting worse, and at least that's better than feeling worse and worse as time passes.

Ed Seedhouse
VA7SDH

I am neither a Doctor, nor any other kind of medical professional.

Actually you know, it is what it isn't.
02-18-2016 08:00 PM
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Aether087 Offline

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Location: Central Leatherstocking Region New York

Post: #10
RE: Sleep stages - can it be monitored by me?
I purchased (cheaply through CraigsList) a ResMed "S+" monitor. It monitors your breathing and movement during the night; does not monitor EEG. Tried it for the first time last night. It appears to follow the data in Sleepyhead, S+ said I had 6 awakenings. These happened when I had events in Sleepyhead. I remember being awake (change position due to sore knee, sore shoulder, etc.) during the night and falling right back to sleep.

The S+ broke down my sleep stages during the night. According to the S+ I am at 90% of REM for my age and 88% of deep sleep for my age. These are the two most important phases of sleep and this data confirms that my APAP is working and validates the fact that I feel great due to using APAP!
02-19-2016 09:09 AM
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