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Take sleep study WITH dental guard or WITHOUT?
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Tommy C Offline

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Post: #21
RE: Take sleep study WITH dental guard or WITHOUT?
(07-20-2012 02:43 PM)BabyDoc Wrote:  If you are feeling so good using the dental guard, why would you want to do the full sleep study or at least half the night, without it? I mean, why become a hosehead if you don't have to be one?

But after getting the machine, will you continue to use it, if your own tests with the guard show you don't still need it? I would doubt it.

Good points, Doc.

I think "feeling good" is a relative thing. The human body can get used to most anything and might think it is feeling good simply because it was feeling "worse" for so long. I need to prove to myself that I can't feel even better, assuming the home study test shows an OSA or central problem.

And yes, it would be a waste of $700 for the S9, but well worth the risk of finding out what is optimum for the best quality sleep.

Using my pawn shop CPAP ResMed Plus is like a leaf blower in my face and I feel like I'm suffocating against the backpressure when exhaling. So it will be an EASY decision not to use it if there's little to no difference.

I work in a very high stress environment (futures trader manager) and need all the quality sleep I can get. Before the mouth guard and side sleeping, I could barely get myself out of bed even after 10 hours of sleep. Now, with 8 hours, I feel decent, but maybe could feel even better, dunno.

Quick story: I was once a manager of electronic technicians in a lab. One guy bought a chili dog from the roach coach for lunch. He threw up later in the day all over his work bench and went home sick for two days. When he came back, he bought another chili dog at the same roach coach. I asked him why in the world would he buy another after getting so sick on the last one? He said he just wanted to make sure it was the chili dog that got him sick...Oh-jeez

I's just gots to know too.

Tom
07-20-2012 04:23 PM
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SuperSleeper Offline

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Post: #22
RE: Take sleep study WITH dental guard or WITHOUT?
I'd be willing to bet good money that ANY dental device (whether home-made or professionally-made) will only reduce apnea events slightly.

I don't believe the hype that all these new "sleep apnea dentists" spew out regarding the effectiveness of dental devices. Yeah, they help some, but when compared to CPAP-- not much.

CPAP can come a lot closer to eliminating the majority of OSA events in nearly all OSA patients. OSA treatment is not simply done to make the patient "feel better" - you need to reduce the AHI levels low enough so that no damage is done to the heart every time your body jolts out of an apnea event with an adrenalin rush. Plus, you also need to reduce AHI to a low enough level that your blood O2 levels aren't compromised. Using a dental device can give a false sense of security to a patient who really would benefit to a greater degree from using a CPAP. There are no data-capable "dental devices" that I know of that can analyze AHI data on the fly like modern CPAPs can do.

If a mouth guard or dental device reduces one's AHI by anything more than 5 points, I'll eat my hat. Too-funny

Treating OSA with a dental device and thinking "all is fine" is a bit like me drinking 10 cups of coffee for my daytime sleepiness and thinking that's the answer to my sleep apnea because "I feel better and more alert". (not that there's anything wrong with drinking coffee, of course.) Coffee Too-funny

Again, just my personal opinion. SHa_biggrin5

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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.

07-20-2012 04:44 PM
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SuperSleeper Offline

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Post: #23
RE: Take sleep study WITH dental guard or WITHOUT?
(07-20-2012 04:23 PM)Tommy C Wrote:  Quick story: I was once a manager of electronic technicians in a lab. One guy bought a chili dog from the roach coach for lunch. He threw up later in the day all over his work bench and went home sick for two days. When he came back, he bought another chili dog at the same roach coach. I asked him why in the world would he buy another after getting so sick on the last one? He said he just wanted to make sure it was the chili dog that got him sick...Oh-jeez

Now THERE"s a good, solid scientifically-oriented person. Love it. Laugh-a-lotToo-funny

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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.

07-20-2012 04:47 PM
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cbramsey Offline

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Post: #24
RE: Take sleep study WITH dental guard or WITHOUT?
(07-20-2012 04:47 PM)SuperSleeper Wrote:  
(07-20-2012 04:23 PM)Tommy C Wrote:  Quick story: I was once a manager of electronic technicians in a lab. One guy bought a chili dog from the roach coach for lunch. He threw up later in the day all over his work bench and went home sick for two days. When he came back, he bought another chili dog at the same roach coach. I asked him why in the world would he buy another after getting so sick on the last one? He said he just wanted to make sure it was the chili dog that got him sick...Oh-jeez

Now THERE"s a good, solid scientifically-oriented person. Love it. Laugh-a-lotToo-funny

Hey SS. I thought that was the definition of INSANITY!!!! Doing the same thing over and over and expecting DIFFERENT results. Too-funny

INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
07-20-2012 05:08 PM
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Tommy C Offline

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Post: #25
RE: Take sleep study WITH dental guard or WITHOUT?
(07-19-2012 01:52 AM)zonk Wrote:  I've checked out and it seem there are two version :
ApneaLink which monitors respiration and blood oxygen saturation
ApneaLink Plus which adds respiratory effort (via the belt) to the mix.
Good luck with the test and hope it goes well for you
ApneaLink Plus - Features and Benefits
http://www.resmed.com/us/products/apneal...s&sec=true

This sounds like an interesting device - something a person with normal sleeping might even buy to keep on top of their sleep patterns. If I find that I do not have OSA (doubtful) I will probably get one of these.

Maybe the home sleep study places sell them off from time to time - or does vender #2 sell them used? They appear to require software in a computer too.

I would think they give more detaled info cuz they have FOUR probes vs: just an air flow sensor in the S9, right?


SuperSleeper:

Well, I think the mouth guard effectiveness would depend on how near to closed the tongue makes the air pathway during sleep (without the guard) and if the small pull of the installed guard is enough to open it, even a little bit. In some people, maybe the pathway is "hard" closed. In others, maybe it is still slightly open and a tug will open it more. In my case, I have seen my chest pains go away over a few weeks of mouthguard use. This was a temp thang to try until I could figure out where to get the sleep study done.

So yes, I understand how OSA can cause heart damage and that was my motivating reason to do something - anything in the interim.

But the study coming up will tell the tale. My prediction is I will become a hosehead, like it or not ...Lolabove

Tom
(This post was last modified: 07-20-2012 05:26 PM by Tommy C.)
07-20-2012 05:13 PM
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Sleepster Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Take sleep study WITH dental guard or WITHOUT?
(07-20-2012 02:43 PM)BabyDoc Wrote:  If you are feeling so good using the dental guard, why would you want to do the full sleep study or at least half the night, without it?

To determine whether or not he has obstructive sleep apnea.

If people could make this determination based upon the way they feel, we wouldn't need sleep studies.

Quote: I mean, why become a hosehead if you don't have to be one?

So, you'd recommend that patients first try a home-made dental appliance to see how they feel, and then prescribe a sleep study only if they don't feel so good?

Quote:If I thought I could get rid of my machine by just sleeping on my side and wearing a dental guard, I would do it in a heartbeat.

What's stopping you?

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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
07-20-2012 05:23 PM
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Sleepster Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Take sleep study WITH dental guard or WITHOUT?
(07-20-2012 04:23 PM)Tommy C Wrote:  Using my pawn shop CPAP ResMed Plus is like a leaf blower in my face and I feel like I'm suffocating against the backpressure when exhaling.

You might want to consider a BiPAP.

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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
07-20-2012 05:26 PM
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Tommy C Offline

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Post: #28
RE: Take sleep study WITH dental guard or WITHOUT?
(07-20-2012 05:26 PM)Sleepster Wrote:  You might want to consider a BiPAP.


I have, but still confused. I see you use one. Is the S9 available in a Bi-PAP version or do I need to go with the model you have?

If so, what is you opinion of one over the other?

Yes, IF I can get away with it, a lower exhale pressure wud make this therapy live-able for me. I have no problems with things on my face or even a mouthpiece all night. But the constant physical struggle to exhale (maybe even causing CSA for me) drives me into a mental panic....
[sigh]

T
07-20-2012 05:36 PM
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Sleepster Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Take sleep study WITH dental guard or WITHOUT?
(07-20-2012 05:36 PM)Tommy C Wrote:  Is the S9 available in a Bi-PAP version or do I need to go with the model you have?

If so, what is you opinion of one over the other?

BiPAP is the Respironics brand name for a bilevel machine. I imagine Resmed must make a bilevel machine?

The big issue is the price. The BiPAP is more than double the cost of the S9.

If you have a low pressure, and you set the exhalation pressure relief to its maximum value of 3, that might do it for you. On the other hand, if your pressure is up in the double digits, and you really can't tolerate exhaling against the pressure, the bilevel machine may be your best bet.

I switched to a BiPAP because of aerophagia. Before that I was on a CPAP at a pressure of 13 and was able to tolerate exhaling against the pressure. I just couldn't tolerate the gas pain. It was keeping me awake.

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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
07-20-2012 09:47 PM
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mjbearit Offline

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Post: #30
RE: Take sleep study WITH dental guard or WITHOUT?
(07-20-2012 04:23 PM)Tommy C Wrote:  Using my pawn shop CPAP ResMed Plus is like a leaf blower in my face and I feel like I'm suffocating against the backpressure when exhaling. So it will be an EASY decision not to use it if there's little to no difference.

Tom,
I feel your pain! I recently "upgraded" my old REMStar plus and bought a "gently used" APAP from Supplier #2 (Secondwind). The old machine, I gleefully refer to it as the "iron lung" was so terrible I was non-compliant for a number of years. I decided that I had to get back into compliance, but I tried everything including a new heated humidifier and it still sucked! I bought a Respironics APAP DS550 with A-Flex and I love it! The APAP gives me the pressure I need, on the fly, and the A-Flex allows me to breathe out with very little effort!
If money is not a problem, give a new APAP serious consideration. What you got from the pawn shop belongs in the same museum display with the Rack and cat-o-nine-tails! Technically a Stanley Steamer was a car, but put it up against a Modern Ferrari and you wonder why they are in the same class! The DS550 is not even the absolute latest, but since the Sleepyhead Software does not yet support the ... okay, senior moment, I forgot what the new one is called, the Pro One or something, I decided on the DS550. I do not regret that at all. Every night I go strap this thing onto my face and I smile because I remember how bad that old machine was!

As always, YMMV! You do not have to agree or disagree, I am not a professional so my mental meanderings are simply recollections of things from my own life.

PRS1 - Auto - A-Flex x2 - 12.50 - 20 - Humid x2 - Swift FX
07-20-2012 10:48 PM
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