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Therapy numbers, lack of them, weight loss, etc
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retired_guy Offline

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Post: #111
RE: Therapy numbers, lack of them, weight loss, etc
(09-20-2014 02:30 PM)Galactus Wrote:  I wonder what others do when they are sick.

Complain to Mrs. R_G incessantly. If that doesn't work, I call the kids and complain to them. If that doesn't work, I put on my mask and go to sleep.... Figure maybe tomorrow somebody will feel sorry for me.
09-20-2014 03:02 PM
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Galactus Offline

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Post: #112
RE: Therapy numbers, lack of them, weight loss, etc
Hey Guys and Gals, and Retired people even, seems AHI is down, and now FL is up. So what is that? I guess it is better than AHI's but what is it and what does it mean?

Day #3 with 13E/20I/2PS
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09-21-2014 04:29 PM
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surferdude2 Offline

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Post: #113
RE: Therapy numbers, lack of them, weight loss, etc
I'd say you're doing excellent. FL = flow limitations and if you have those but have no apnea events at the same time they occur, then it means your pressure level at that time was either sufficient or quickly rose to meet the task and prevented any event from being flagged. That's what it's supposed to do.

BTW, flow limitations are registered as a decimal part of 1, 1 being fully restricted and 0 being fully open. For example a flow limitation registering .1 would mean you were 10% restricted, a .13 would mean 13% restricted,...
(This post was last modified: 09-21-2014 04:45 PM by surferdude2.)
09-21-2014 04:40 PM
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vsheline Online

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Post: #114
RE: Therapy numbers, lack of them, weight loss, etc
(09-21-2014 04:29 PM)Galactus Wrote:  seems AHI is down, and now FL is up. So what is that? I guess it is better than AHI's but what is it and what does it mean?

FL is obstructive in type. If you had been using a lower and fixed value for pressure (like on your old brick machine, except with a lower pressure setting), those FL events may have turned into full Hypopnea or Apnea events.

Your congestion may not be fully gone yet, and the number of obstructive events like FL may continue to reduce as your congestion continues to clear, if everything else stays constant, unchanged.

But everything else never stays constant.

The AHI we get for a night is strongly influenced by our sleep position when we happen to be in REM sleep, which varies night to night.

And lots of other things have strong or slight influences on our sleep.

So hard to say yet what last night's results mean. We would need to gather overall results for a week or a month before we would be able to assess what the average results are for a set of settings.

Membership in the Advisory Member group should not be understood as in any way implying medical expertise or qualification for advising Sleep Apnea patients concerning their treatment. The Advisory Member group provides advice and suggestions to Apnea Board administrators and staff on matters concerning Apnea Board operation and administrative policies - not on matters concerning treatment for Sleep Apnea. I think it is now too late to change the name of the group but I think Voting Member group would perhaps have been a more descriptive name for the group.
(This post was last modified: 09-21-2014 05:30 PM by vsheline.)
09-21-2014 05:23 PM
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Galactus Offline

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Post: #115
RE: Therapy numbers, lack of them, weight loss, etc
(09-21-2014 04:40 PM)surferdude2 Wrote:  I'd say you're doing excellent. FL = flow limitations and if you have those but have no apnea events at the same time they occur, then it means your pressure level at that time was either sufficient or quickly rose to meet the task and prevented any event from being flagged. That's what it's supposed to do.

BTW, flow limitations are registered as a decimal part of 1, 1 being fully restricted and 0 being fully open. For example a flow limitation registering .1 would mean you were 10% restricted, a .13 would mean 13% restricted,...

Thanks for the explanation, I had known it stood for flow limitation, but the info on percentage was good to know. Very helpful indeed. Thank you.

(09-21-2014 05:23 PM)vsheline Wrote:  
(09-21-2014 04:29 PM)Galactus Wrote:  seems AHI is down, and now FL is up. So what is that? I guess it is better than AHI's but what is it and what does it mean?

FL is obstructive in type. If you had been using a lower and fixed value for pressure (like on your old brick machine, except with a lower pressure setting), those FL events may have turned into full Hypopnea or Apnea events.

Your congestion may not be fully gone yet, and the number of obstructive events like FL may continue to reduce as your congestion continues to clear, if everything else stays constant, unchanged.

But everything else never stays constant.

The AHI we get for a night is strongly influenced by our sleep position when we happen to be in REM sleep, which varies night to night.

And lots of other things have strong or slight influences on our sleep.

So hard to say yet what last night's results mean. We need to focus on overall results for the week or month before we can see what the average results are for a set of settings.

Gotcha. Well it does seem that raising PS has made a positive effect. I guess we'll have to stand by and see how the results reflect at the end of the week.

Your experience, assistance and explanations have been invaluable. Thank you so much for your help to date and your continued help.

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(This post was last modified: 09-21-2014 05:31 PM by Galactus.)
09-21-2014 05:31 PM
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archangle Online
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Post: #116
RE: Therapy numbers, lack of them, weight loss, etc
(09-21-2014 04:40 PM)surferdude2 Wrote:  BTW, flow limitations are registered as a decimal part of 1, 1 being fully restricted and 0 being fully open. For example a flow limitation registering .1 would mean you were 10% restricted, a .13 would mean 13% restricted,...

The flow limitation does go from 0 to 1.

It does NOT mean you were a certain "percent" restricted. For instance, a flow limitation of 0.99 does not mean you aren't breathing.

It's not that clear what the value of the number means, other than 0 is the best and 1 is the worst. It's an evaluation of the shape of the waveform according to some algorithm. I'm not sure they disclose the algorithm. A flow limitation number of 0 indicates something like a sine wave, and a number of 1 indicates something like a square wave.

Flow limitations indicate that there is "mechanical" resistance to airflow when you inhale. It's sort of a "pre apnea" condition. Think of it as being like trying to breathe through a straw.

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09-21-2014 09:17 PM
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archangle Online
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Post: #117
RE: Therapy numbers, lack of them, weight loss, etc
Dude, you're obsessing.

Leave it alone for a while. After a week or so, see how you are doing in terms of how you feel, etc.

Write down your current settings and save them somewhere.

After a week or so, if you're not getting signs of problems, consider yourself cured. Tinker with the settings "for fun" if you want to, but realize that you're doing an intellectual exercise, not something you need to do.

Get the free SleepyHead software here.
Useful links.
Click here for information on the main alternative to CPAP.
If it's midnight and a DME tells you it's dark outside, go and check it yourself.
09-21-2014 09:22 PM
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Galactus Offline

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Post: #118
RE: Therapy numbers, lack of them, weight loss, etc
(09-21-2014 09:22 PM)archangle Wrote:  Dude, you're obsessing.

Leave it alone for a while. After a week or so, see how you are doing in terms of how you feel, etc.

Write down your current settings and save them somewhere.

After a week or so, if you're not getting signs of problems, consider yourself cured. Tinker with the settings "for fun" if you want to, but realize that you're doing an intellectual exercise, not something you need to do.

Me? Obsess? Do you know me? Have you been talking to my wife? It sounds like you might know me, lol. I obsess on just about everything I do. In this case though in all seriousness I wasn't trying to obsess, I was just trying to learn how raising and lowering these settings are effecting the results. I took vsheline's advise on the original settings, and then again on the adjustments. I have noted with the second adjustments my AHI had dropped to 0. Something that had never happened before. But I had noted that the Flow Limitation had gone up, and since I didn't understand that I just thought I'd ask. I promise I'm doing my best not to obsess (really).

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09-21-2014 09:45 PM
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retired_guy Offline

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Post: #119
RE: Therapy numbers, lack of them, weight loss, etc
(09-21-2014 04:29 PM)Galactus Wrote:  Hey Guys and Gals, and Retired people even, seems AHI is down, and now FL is up. So what is that? I guess it is better than AHI's but what is it and what does it mean?

Ok......... Who are you and what have you done with Galactus' OA's?
09-21-2014 10:00 PM
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GeoffD Offline

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Post: #120
RE: Therapy numbers, lack of them, weight loss, etc
(09-21-2014 09:17 PM)archangle Wrote:  The flow limitation does go from 0 to 1.

It does NOT mean you were a certain "percent" restricted. For instance, a flow limitation of 0.99 does not mean you aren't breathing.

It's not that clear what the value of the number means, other than 0 is the best and 1 is the worst. It's an evaluation of the shape of the waveform according to some algorithm. I'm not sure they disclose the algorithm. A flow limitation number of 0 indicates something like a sine wave, and a number of 1 indicates something like a square wave.

Flow limitations indicate that there is "mechanical" resistance to airflow when you inhale. It's sort of a "pre apnea" condition. Think of it as being like trying to breathe through a straw.

This is really useful information. I didn't understand what the machine was measuring. Thanks.
09-24-2014 07:42 AM
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