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Weight Gain From Water Retention
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Louis R. Offline

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Post: #21
RE: Weight Gain From Water Retention
(09-09-2015 11:17 AM)justMongo Wrote:  
(09-09-2015 09:12 AM)Louis R. Wrote:  Good morning,
Last time you weighed in on the weight gain issue you spoke about the problem regarding thoracic pressure with CPAP, and that you were considering BiPAP.
Since my post in August, and with the slowly upward weight gain, I've had appointments with my sleep doctor and my primary doctor. Both say that there is no medical studies indicating a link between CPAP and weigh gain. They suggested blood work and I had it with no existing problems found. Basically I wasted time going to see them.
The sleep doctor said to stop using the machine to see if my weight goes down but that will cause me to suffer the original severe OSA.
He also said to go to a dentist and maybe try a MAD mouth piece. Dentist made devices are very expensive and insurance doesn't cover it... so I bought an inexpensive SNORE RX ($99) brand on-line and I got it yesterday. After boiling it and biting for fitting purposes I found it very tight when I went to sleep and aborted it's use, so I will try again tonight re-boiling and refitting.
Other than a daily Glucophage I'm taking one Lasix a week.
All I know is that the weight gain has continued, and it is very stressful (an understatement) for me and for my concerned wife.

Louis: Do you have a cardiologist? Given your age and sleep apnea, it is wise to consult a cardiologist and have a workup. Such as echocardiogram or SPECT scan under exercise.

My visit last week to my primary care MD included chest x-rays, blood work, electrocardiogram, complete examination and them some. He said I was fine except for slight blood glucose issue... so he said take Glucophage twice daily and loose weight. I'm not satisfied with that diagnosis. Plus consider that every time I've used PAP I gain weight??
09-09-2015 11:47 AM
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justMongo Offline

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Post: #22
RE: Weight Gain From Water Retention
(09-09-2015 11:47 AM)Louis R. Wrote:  
(09-09-2015 11:17 AM)justMongo Wrote:  Louis: Do you have a cardiologist? Given your age and sleep apnea, it is wise to consult a cardiologist and have a workup. Such as echocardiogram or SPECT scan under exercise.

My visit last week to my primary care MD included chest x-rays, blood work, electrocardiogram, complete examination and them some. He said I was fine except for slight blood glucose issue... so he said take Glucophage twice daily and loose weight. I'm not satisfied with that diagnosis. Plus consider that every time I've used PAP I gain weight??

When I'm not comfortable with a diagnosis, I seek further investigation. You have a weight and blood sugar issue.
Weight gain that's transient may indicate greater issues.

Not to wander too far afield... I have a friend in a little mining town in Nevada who was taking Glucophage and a single blood pressure med. He's in his 60s; and heavy. He found himself in congestive heart failure last January. The warning signs were their; but his local GP missed them. That was a wake up call for him. He's lost weight; is seriously controlling his blood sugar; getting some exercise.

Be healthy...

Kindest regards,

Mongo

INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
09-09-2015 12:46 PM
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Louis R. Offline

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Post: #23
RE: Weight Gain From Water Retention
(09-09-2015 12:46 PM)justMongo Wrote:  
(09-09-2015 11:47 AM)Louis R. Wrote:  [quote='justMongo' pid='130304' dateline='1441815457']
uote]

When I'm not comfortable with a diagnosis, I seek further investigation. You have a weight and blood sugar issue.
Weight gain that's transient may indicate greater issues.

Not to wander too far afield... I have a friend in a little mining town in Nevada who was taking Glucophage and a single blood pressure med. He's in his 60s; and heavy. He found himself in congestive heart failure last January. The warning signs were their; but his local GP missed them. That was a wake up call for him. He's lost weight; is seriously controlling his blood sugar; getting some exercise.

Be healthy...

Kindest regards,

Mongo
I agree with you regarding getting another opinion besides the sleep MD and the primary. I also need to see if I can get the mad device to be comfortable enough so that I can rule in or out CPAP... I believe that PAP has to be addressed if only to adjust it properly.

Thank you.
09-09-2015 01:24 PM
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DariaVader Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Weight Gain From Water Retention
Here's some studies that your doc says didnt happen Wink

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/581344_7
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC29011/
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9510662 indicating bipap as a relief for the edema

I turned my EPR to max immediately upon finding this information and noted an improvement. I have also had every kind of workup to make sure there were not other causes (there probably are - but they are "subclinical" at this time) The benefit I got out of that work up is that an arrhythmia I have been complaining about since childhood was finally seen and exists rather than being all in my cute little head. but I digress Big Grin I have discussed this information with my sleepdoc - he was previously unaware of it, but is completely on board with moving me to bipap; however since there was improvement with the EPR we decided to wait. Currently, I am back to getting up at night to pee and experiencing less retention. Oh - my doc also upped my dose of hydrochlorothyazide (HCT) which provided a further improvement and probably accounts for the return to nocturia.

هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه
Tongue Suck Technique for prevention of mouth breathing:
  • Place your tongue behind your front teeth on the roof of your mouth
  • let your tongue fill the space between the upper molars
  • gently suck to form a light vacuum
Practising during the day can help you to keep it at night

هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه
09-09-2015 05:07 PM
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Louis R. Offline

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Post: #25
RE: Weight Gain From Water Retention
(09-09-2015 05:07 PM)DariaVader Wrote:  Here's some studies that your doc says didnt happen Wink

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/581344_7
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC29011/
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9510662 indicating bipap as a relief for the edema

I turned my EPR to max immediately upon finding this information and noted an improvement. I have also had every kind of workup to make sure there were not other causes (there probably are - but they are "subclinical" at this time) The benefit I got out of that work up is that an arrhythmia I have been complaining about since childhood was finally seen and exists rather than being all in my cute little head. but I digress Big Grin I have discussed this information with my sleepdoc - he was previously unaware of it, but is completely on board with moving me to bipap; however since there was improvement with the EPR we decided to wait. Currently, I am back to getting up at night to pee and experiencing less retention. Oh - my doc also upped my dose of hydrochlorothyazide (HCT) which provided a further improvement and probably accounts for the return to nocturia.
Daria... my sleep doctor didn't have much to say when I suggested BiPAP. Also, since I started on CPAP, I rarely get up to pee. When I told the doctor about this, and that I thought that the lack of night time peeing as a reason for water retention, he discounted that. He said that the body auto regulates itself by peeing more when awake.
Can you please explain what "turning my ERP to max" means.

If I don't get any further insight from doctors, I'm going to have to experiment on my own. So adjustment to CPAP are in order.

Thank you.
09-09-2015 08:56 PM
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Jim Bronson Online

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Post: #26
RE: Weight Gain From Water Retention
Very interesting thread. Good research work DariaVader. I have been noticing slight fluid retention in my feet right just below where the front of the ankle starts to curve into the foot itself around the big bones on either side. There's no swelling in the ankle or lower in the foot. I'm getting my ticker checked out, to rule out heart failure. I had a blood test called BNP, which is an indicator for cardiac hypertension. Mine is so low, it can't be reliably measured (normal is any reading below 99), so that's encouraging. ECG is good, and I'm going in for a heart ultrasound just to make sure. I'm also getting religious about restricting sodium to less than 2000mg per day. I'm not overweight, but I've gained about 5 lbs with the fluid retention. My swelling actually goes away overnight and then slowly come back during the day, except that sometimes it doesn't. I'm not worried yet, but I'm keeping my eye on it. This thread helps a lot.
09-09-2015 09:01 PM
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Louis R. Offline

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Post: #27
RE: Weight Gain From Water Retention
(09-09-2015 09:01 PM)Jim Bronson Wrote:  Very interesting thread. Good research work DariaVader. I have been noticing slight fluid retention in my feet right just below where the front of the ankle starts to curve into the foot itself around the big bones on either side. There's no swelling in the ankle or lower in the foot. I'm getting my ticker checked out, to rule out heart failure. I had a blood test called BNP, which is an indicator for cardiac hypertension. Mine is so low, it can't be reliably measured (normal is any reading below 99), so that's encouraging. ECG is good, and I'm going in for a heart ultrasound just to make sure. I'm also getting religious about restricting sodium to less than 2000mg per day. I'm not overweight, but I've gained about 5 lbs with the fluid retention. My swelling actually goes away overnight and then slowly come back during the day, except that sometimes it doesn't. I'm not worried yet, but I'm keeping my eye on it. This thread helps a lot.
Jim... I've gained 12 pounds since I started CPAP on 7/23/15. Sodium isn't an issue either since I cook and my wife is on a very low sodium diet. At this stage I'm scratching my head. I'm also very concerned.
09-09-2015 09:08 PM
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Jim Bronson Online

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Post: #28
RE: Weight Gain From Water Retention
I was just reinforcing the need to keep sodium intake under control. When I eat at restaurants and see how much sodium-laced food people eat, I wonder how they live past 40.

EPR is Expiratory Pressure Relief. There's a lot of info on it in the Resmed literature. There's an adjustment for it in the clinical menu.
09-09-2015 09:54 PM
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Louis R. Offline

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Post: #29
RE: Weight Gain From Water Retention
(09-09-2015 09:54 PM)Jim Bronson Wrote:  I was just reinforcing the need to keep sodium intake under control. When I eat at restaurants and see how much sodium-laced food people eat, I wonder how they live past 40.

EPR is Expiratory Pressure Relief. There's a lot of info on it in the Resmed literature. There's an adjustment for it in the clinical menu.

You make a great point about eating out. We try to limit it to once or twice a week... It's usually my wife who likes to go out to eat but we try to watch sodium as best as possible at restaurants.
I'll look into ERP with my Respironics System One and an adjustment.

Thank you
09-09-2015 10:29 PM
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DariaVader Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Weight Gain From Water Retention
Louis, EPR is the Resmed variety of pressure relief, as Jim said. For the Respironics (PR) machine you would want to experiment with A-flex and C-flex - I think that the c-flex is most similar to EPR but someone who knows PR better could correct me on that Smile Set it to c-flex 3 and see if that helps any. Bipap is just a machine that allows for greater pressure relief. When your pressure goes up to 8 on the inhale, it will drop to 5 on exhale with c-flex = 3.

هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه
Tongue Suck Technique for prevention of mouth breathing:
  • Place your tongue behind your front teeth on the roof of your mouth
  • let your tongue fill the space between the upper molars
  • gently suck to form a light vacuum
Practising during the day can help you to keep it at night

هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه هههههه
09-09-2015 11:52 PM
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