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o2 drop at beginning of CPAP and falling asleep
#1
o2 drop at beginning of CPAP and falling asleep
Little did I know that every night as I drift off to sleep in 5 to 10 min that my o2 drops by 7 to 12 pts.  I bought a O2Ring by Wellue/ViatomTech and the only time I see big desat is at beginning of light sleep/start of CPAP.  The import into Oscar is really easy on my Mac, btw, and there does not seem to be much at all in the way of desat during events.  (I am still waiting to hear from someone about the movement cleanup feature which eliminates a lot of apparently spurious desat events.)  What causes desat at beginning of sleep cycle? Anything to do about it in terms of CPAP settings?  

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#2
RE: o2 drop at beginning of CPAP and falling asleep
    hopefully I can correctly attach an upload image...
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#3
RE: o2 drop at beginning of CPAP and falling asleep
Do you have a graph showing O2. Mine shows a full time graph all night and you can see the drops and amount, being able to look at the flow rate zoomed in with the O2 rate.
Apnea (80-100%) 10 seconds, Hypopnea (50-80%) 10 seconds, Flow Limits (0-50%) not timed  Cervical Collar - Dealing w DME - Chart Organizing
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#4
RE: o2 drop at beginning of CPAP and falling asleep
The hand-off from waking to sleeping is a complicated neurochemical process. For example, some people are prone to central apneas during this period. I wonder whether your desats are a manifestation of a stage in the process.

In the chart you posted, there are two events and then a gap in your use of the machine. Before the gap, had you started to fall asleep? Did the events perhaps wake you up?
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#5
RE: o2 drop at beginning of CPAP and falling asleep
    Observant Questions!  The gap is because I had set the notification on the O2Ring to 95% just to see what would happen.  Ugh! Had to turn everything off, re-set, and restart.  Yes, I definitely was in light stage 1 sleep and had the O2 alarm not gone off a bunch of times in just a few minutes, I would have fallen asleep, peacefully.  All the rest of the empty space in the O2 graph was because of the artifact clean-up.  I just tried something else, which was to lie down, wide awake, and see what happened to my O2.  Stayed at 98% consistently over 10 minutes, so it is not simply being in prone position.  So, yes, it is something about transitioning from wakefulness to light sleep, and perhaps I should not even be concerned with it.  But as another forum member said, it is also puzzling that none of the hypopnea apnea events correspond to any sort of desat.  By definition, over 10 sec of not breathing should produce some desat, should it not?  Anyway, I figured out how to drag the graph by the label, so now you can see the whole picture.

BTW I just want to briefly apologize and state that I am a complete newbie to this Forum, so using F12 on the Mac for screenshots, dragging graphs, uploading too large files, all have happened in just the past 24 hrs since registering.  Thanks for your patience.
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#6
RE: o2 drop at beginning of CPAP and falling asleep
No apologies allowed!

Yes, you want that blankety-blank alarm turned off!

And I think you should not worry about the sleep-transition drops in O2 sats. It is completely normal to have lower O2 levels while sleeping, and anything over 90 is A-OK. The very brief spikes down to 88 or 89 are absolutely nothing to worry about.

It is very common to see no significant desats accompanying apneas or hypopneas. For example, during my sleep study, I had an AHI of 23 and as I recall, only a few desats of 4% or more, with none below 90.
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#7
RE: o2 drop at beginning of CPAP and falling asleep
    Wow, glad I came back to this thread! It'd be nice if ApneaBoard notifies us after the first email...Anyway, thanks so much.  In my most recent home sleep study that got insurance to pay for my AirSense, it showed desat down to 80% for each event, without, of course, CPAP.  So, even though untreated I fall into mild to moderate mostly OSA, it concerned me about that desat number since I have a co-existing heart arrhythmia, recently fixed 100% by ablation.  I am attaching my fully edited and ApneaBoard encouraged layout; please tell me what you think.  I have decided to play with the EPR setting to On at 3 with min pressure at 7, just to see if I feel any different or the numbers change at all.  Thanks for your help and support.
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#8
RE: o2 drop at beginning of CPAP and falling asleep
You can be notified.  When using the Full Reply editor, look at the bottom left of the editor window.  You have a Thread Subscription option.  Another way to subscribe to a thread is to go navigate to the thread you wish to subscribe to, then click the Subscribe to this thread link towards the bottom of the page.  

Any time you want to unsubscribe, or are just curious, go to your UserCP and look at the lower left for Subscribed Threads
Crimson Nape
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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
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#9
RE: o2 drop at beginning of CPAP and falling asleep
Sounds like you had a real desat problem that has been well resolved by PAP -- that's excellent. And I think your proposed revision to your settings sounds good, mainly because I think it will be more comfortable for you.

When you next post a chart, in the left panel be sure to show the top part, which includes your AHI, machine info, and pressure range. It's OK if that means the bottom drops off. Also, include just these graphs:

Events
Flow rate
Pressure
Leaks
Snores
Flow limitations.

Also O2, if you've imported it. No need for mask pressure.

Keep us posted!
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#10
RE: o2 drop at beginning of CPAP and falling asleep
Thanks--got it all! This really is an amazing forum.  Thought for today is changing my chin posture.  What a simple and cool possible corrective measure. My guess is this is the only place I could have heard about the collar and why.

greg
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