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+--- Thread: First night with new gear: AirTouch F20 and Ultimate Chinstrap (/Thread-First-night-with-new-gear-AirTouch-F20-and-Ultimate-Chinstrap)
First night with new gear: AirTouch F20 and Ultimate Chinstrap - Shin Ryoku - 01-24-2018
I recently ordered an AirTouch F20 to see if I could get along with a full face mask and forego the whole mouth leak prevention routine. Also ordered an Ultimate Chinstrap (UC) hoping that would simplify mouth leak prevention with my usual nasal pillows mask. As luck would have it, they both arrived yesterday.
Obviously I can't use the both at the same time (UC covers the mouth), and I decided to try the new mask first. When I put on the F20, I could feel it pushing my jaw back a little. That and some reading about neck flexion, cervical collars, etc, had me trying the soft cervical collar again. Here I am ready for sleep:
![[Image: 28093040279_cd991de72f_o.jpg]](https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4610/28093040279_cd991de72f_o.jpg)
After 3h21m, I woke up feeling pretty uncomfortable due to the collar. Took everything off, put on the Ultimate Chinstrap, my DreamWear Gel Pillows mask, no collar this time, and slept another 3h until my alarm woke me for work.
Here's how the night looked in SH:
![[Image: 25999801408_f536ea8a35_h.jpg]](https://c1.staticflickr.com/5/4744/25999801408_f536ea8a35_h.jpg)
I can't really say much about how well the F20 and/or collar work for me based on this night because I changed them both at the same time and only wore them for 3h. The combination of the two doesn't seem great for me based on this one session. What I can say is that the F20 was pretty comfortable. It's probably my favorite full face mask (also own Simplus, Amara View).
The UC is very comfortable, soft, and seems to work really well for preventing mouth leak despite the fact that I can breathe through it if I try. I think the UC + Gel Pillows is likely to be my combination of choice going forwards.
RE: First night with new gear: AirTouch F20 and Ultimate Chinstrap - Walla Walla - 01-24-2018
Shin, The cevical collar your using is way too thick. It's no wonder you find the collar uncomfortable.
RE: First night with new gear: AirTouch F20 and Ultimate Chinstrap - Shin Ryoku - 01-24-2018
I bought 4 of them of different height, firmness, thickness. This is the least uncomfortable one amongst them. It's thick but a bit softer and more compressible.
Is there a particular one you recommend? I'm happy to try another.
RE: First night with new gear: AirTouch F20 and Ultimate Chinstrap - Walla Walla - 01-24-2018
No. Just like masks you have to try them and pick the one that works for you. Of course it's not for everyone.
RE: First night with new gear: AirTouch F20 and Ultimate Chinstrap - Shin Ryoku - 01-24-2018
I'm guessing that the reason I get more flow limitation and higher AHI with full face masks in general is likely related to either neck flexion or mandible movement, both of which could be helped with a collar, so I'd very love to find a collar that can work for me.
RE: First night with new gear: AirTouch F20 and Ultimate Chinstrap - zzzZorro - 01-24-2018
(01-24-2018, 08:08 AM)Shin Ryok Wrote: The UC is very comfortable, soft, and seems to work really well for preventing mouth leak despite the fact that I can breathe through it if I try. I think the UC + Gel Pillows is likely to be my combination of choice going forwards.
Shin; Keep us updated on the Ultimate Chin Strap. Looked at it a while ago but shied-away from the cost. Appeared like it could work well with pillows..
RE: First night with new gear: AirTouch F20 and Ultimate Chinstrap - ajack - 01-24-2018
You get a lot less leak/mouthbreathe on FFM, Your machine is also seems to be responding more to breathing/apnea events better. You got less apnea recorded with nasal mask and leaks/mouth, or they didn't happen
RE: First night with new gear: AirTouch F20 and Ultimate Chinstrap - JesseLee - 01-24-2018
I'm not familiar with that particular mask (F20) as I haven't used it. Looking at the picture it seems as though it's pulled really tight against your face. I'm wondering if it's too tight. I use a Simplus FFM, I have it adjusted such that the mask is held in place well by the head gear. I can feel the mask slightly inflate forming a seal to my face. Not so loose that the inflation is dramatic and the mask moves away from my face so far that as the night goes on and pressure comes up it will develop leaks, and not so tight that the cushion is fully compressed.
RE: First night with new gear: AirTouch F20 and Ultimate Chinstrap - Shin Ryoku - 01-24-2018
Your profile indicates a Max treatment pressure of 14cm H2O. I spend a lot of time near 20cm H2O and set my straps for that pressure. When I am at the lower end of my pressure range, they look quite tight, accordingly.
RE: First night with new gear: AirTouch F20 and Ultimate Chinstrap - HalfAsleep - 01-24-2018
I was about to point out how way too tight your F20 is, and someone beat me to it. You'll have trench marks on your face in no time, or else a bad case of TMJ. Give yourself a break!
You might need to experiment quite a bit with a mask to get it right, and not just a night or two. If your F20 is comfortable, it might be a keeper, at least for emergencies.
Also, I can't figure out why you'd want to try a cervical collar, especially at the same time as your auditioning a new FFM. If it were me, I'd get the mask sorted out, post my SleepyHead charts, and see if the collar would be either necessary or helpful.
I am very happy with my FFM. I don't have to wear any extra accoutrements. I sleep way better than with the P10. The collar doesn't work for me AT ALL: either my chin buries itself into the collar, or I risk strangulation, or it gets extremely lumpy at the back. Very hard on the neck. Besides, my upper jaw would just open and slack the lower jaw, so it defeated the purpose of limiting mouth breathing. However, to each his own. That's just my personal experience.