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Has anyone here got jaw surgery? - goku - 06-07-2022
My other thread where I ask if I should get jaw surgery or a CPAP wasn't specifically asking people here if they got jaw surgery and if they improved, so I want to start a thread to ask people about their experience. Im considering it. I feel my tongue, when im fully relaxed, sits right at the air cavity thing and blocks the air path. Somehow when all muscles are relaxed, it manages to block the air. Im not sure if CPAP would fix this or if jaw surgery would. I just want to ask specifically, if someone got jaw surgery and managed to stop using a CPAP. If so, what did you get and explain your experience. If you haven't got it, is it because you are not sure it would work, or scared of possible sides or something?
RE: Has anyone here got jaw surgery? - Sleeprider - 06-08-2022
Read this wiki on positional apnea and consider if it might be possible that your problem might resolve if your chin did not tuck as your relaxed. http://www.apneaboard.com/wiki/index.php/Optimizing_therapy#Positional_Apnea
RE: Has anyone here got jaw surgery? - SleepyDaze - 06-16-2022
Jaw surgery, no, but it was suggested/recommended to me at one time. I didn't think I could deal with the process. What I have done is to get a sleep appliance that holds my jaw forward while sleeping. I'm currently using a Somnomed Avant; previously a model that looked like the current Somnomed Flex. Both have been quite helpful, as I have yet to tolerate CPAP for more than a few hours. I'm currently attempting CPAP again, though, as these have not been quite enough for me lately.
RE: Has anyone here got jaw surgery? - RainbowFish - 06-16-2022
Ditto for me. Decades ago they recommended a sliding osteotomy to shorten my jaw (in my case because it dislocated), but I opted for a similar MAD (mandibular advancement device) appliance instead to let my lower jaw slide forward without getting caught behind my upper teeth. Eventually I stopped using it but started over again when I was diagnosed with sleep apnea. When I went to see the dentist this time, he said something to the effect of "thank goodness you did not do that" because surgery would mess up the bite and/or risk nerve damage in an unfixable way.
I am glad I got the MAD, as I can breathe much better through my nose with it, but it is not effective enough to replace the CPAP for the OSA for me either. If you are considering surgery for the OSA, I would advise trying the MAD first and see how helpful advancing the jaw is for you.
RE: Has anyone here got jaw surgery? - goku - 06-28-2022
(06-08-2022, 07:11 PM)Sleeprider Wrote: Read this wiki on positional apnea and consider if it might be possible that your problem might resolve if your chin did not tuck as your relaxed. http://www.apneaboard.com/wiki/index.php/Optimizing_therapy#Positional_Apnea
Yes, my airway is better if im not looking down past a certain angle, but the problem is, even at a theoretical perfect angle, when my face is fully relaxed, the jaw sort of falls down as you would expect due gravity, then my tongue tends to go up and blocks the air pathway.
If I look up the air goes throught but my mouth is open and I would be sleeping mouthbreathing which is not ideal.
(06-16-2022, 10:14 PM)RainbowFish Wrote: When I went to see the dentist this time, he said something to the effect of "thank goodness you did not do that" because surgery would mess up the bite and/or risk nerve damage in an unfixable way.
Well, it should be more like "it is possible this happens" but a good surgeon usually gives you good results.
The problem with a jaw device, the way I see it is that it is artificial, you are just jutting your jaw basically, and this could lead to TMD. Also, I think I need counterclockwise rotation to adjust my upper teeth and get a good bite when im advancing my jaw, otherwise my teeth touch, but my molars have a gap where they don't touch.
RE: Has anyone here got jaw surgery? - mswertfager - 06-28-2022
Hi Goku,
Yes, I had a few of the surgeries, the last being the big MMA. However, not before exhausting all the other roads 1st (turbinate surgery, CPAP, BiPAP, mouth device, positional therapy, mUPP surgery, turbinate surgery #2). If I was able to, I would have preferred to have stayed with the combination of CPAP + mouth device + positional therapy, but aerophagia set in and I had to move into the more serious surgeries.
I paid (mostly out of pocket) for a renowned MMA surgeon, but even a successful surgery comes with slow healing and extra hassles. I got the MMA over a year ago in Mar 2021, the roof of my mouth is still slowly getting sensation back (mostly still numb), TMJ is easily triggered (still phasing in hard to chew items e.g. thick bread, taffy, rough steak), orthodontia work due to the bridge wiring through the teeth, and getting use to my new jaw line.
Also, some people find that they still need to manage minor apnea after the surgery. While my apena is mostly gone, several months ago, I found that I feel better when I continue to do positional therapy night...without it I feel groggy and disconnected the next day. My counselor from a couple years ago (when I was going through chronic sleep dep - when I had to drop the CPAP/BiPAP cold turkey due to the aerophagia) also had the MMA and he too had to do positional therapy afterwards.
Hope this helps...
-Michael
RE: Has anyone here got jaw surgery? - GoliGoli - 06-29-2022
(06-28-2022, 01:39 PM)mswertfager Wrote:
Also, some people find that they still need to manage minor apnea after the surgery. While my apena is mostly gone, several months ago, I found that I feel better when I continue to do positional therapy night...without it I feel groggy and disconnected the next day. My counselor from a couple years ago (when I was going through chronic sleep dep - when I had to drop the CPAP/BiPAP cold turkey due to the aerophagia) also had the MMA and he too had to do positional therapy afterwards.
Hope this helps...
-Michael
I assume you tried titrating the pressure to deal with the aerophagia? Last night was my second night using CPAP and I definitely have been feeling the bloating/aerophagia so I'm curious what the typical response is. I assume lowering the pressure as long as that doesn't make it so it's too low to open the airway?
RE: Has anyone here got jaw surgery? - mswertfager - 06-29-2022
(06-29-2022, 11:11 AM)GoliGoli Wrote: I assume you tried titrating the pressure to deal with the aerophagia? Last night was my second night using CPAP and I definitely have been feeling the bloating/aerophagia so I'm curious what the typical response is. I assume lowering the pressure as long as that doesn't make it so it's too low to open the airway?
When I initially experienced aerophagia, the doctors sent me to a fitting specialist to try various masks. This can sometimes resolve aerophagia issues. Also a BiPAP (prescribed by your doctor) with different in and out pressures can help. Additionally, higher end PAP devices have auto tuning capabilities based on your breathing which might be helpful. Only after I exhausted these approaches did the doctors and I step down my pressure.
Since stepping down the pressure can lead to more obstructions in the night, you might consider reaching out to your doctor and trying some of the above approaches first.
RE: Has anyone here got jaw surgery? - pholynyk - 06-30-2022
>>>Only after I exhausted these approaches did the doctors and I step down my pressure.
Dropping the pressure should have been the first approach!
It does take a balance between OA and aerophagia, but using EPR or the bilevel can help with that, along with daily monitoring of results with OSCAR. Sometimes as little as .2 or .4 cm H2O can make a difference.
RE: Has anyone here got jaw surgery? - mswertfager - 07-12-2022
Perhaps.
For me, when I initially started getting aerophagia it was minimally bugging me. So I was not in a rush. A call to the doctor quickly got me on track a mask fitting. I also switched to a biPAP which helped a lot. A couple years later aerophagia started up again but this time very intensified (full burps and wake-ups), only large drops of pressure kept it at bay. I dropped it from 14 to 12, a few months later down to 10, a few more months later down to 9...thats when I started looking seriously at surgeries.