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02-17-2025, 03:38 AM (This post was last modified: 02-17-2025, 03:39 AM by Kessy.)
Newbie, 7 days and still trouble TICKLING
Hi.
I got a AirSense 11 with a ResMed AirFit F20 full face mask. And its not working well for me. I've struggled with mask leaks and it didn't stop until I changed the pressure from 4-20 which my provider had preset (though the grumpy lady testing it out on me saw me panick with 20 and said "oh, so that's too high"??). The leaks stopped when I changed to maximum pressure 12 (tried lowering it slowly)
But the last 3 nights I've waken up after under 4 hours (the compliance goal) and taken it off, since it starts a new reading after I restart it. And I can't cope sleeping with it for another 4 hours.
This night I woke up a bit more and noticed what it is that is awaking me. It's that the air blowing at my nose tickles it. On the side of my nose. It was really bad! I tried to cope but it was impossible to sleep.. ? After one week I'm more exhausted than before.
Also the machine hasn't lowered my AHI score but increased it. Tonight it was only 15.2 but last night it was over 25.
Not sure how to deal with this - the tickling from the air wasn't a soft gentle tickle but the air was blowing so strong against the sides of my nose I really could sleep.
The clusters of Apneas are Positional Apneas they are caused by chin tucking or you are simply in a position that your airway bends. It is like a garden hose that you bend to shut the water off. Pressure will not help it. You must find a position that will, for me that was sleeping on my side rather than my back. Sometimes a lower pillow will help or a soft cervical collar to stop the chin tucking. If you look below I have a link to Positional Apnea that will give you more information. Your flow limits are very bad and as your are already using EPR at 3 all that you can do is raise your minimum pressure I would start at 10cm with a 16cm max pressure and see if that helps. Although, as I said the pressure increase will not fix the Positional Apnea. You must find a solution to that or the pressure increase will not do anything. You also need to work on your air leaks, they can cause arousals and if they are bad leaks the CPAP can not compensate for them by raising the pressure.
Welcome to the forum and good luck with your treatment.
This night I woke up a bit more and noticed what it
(02-17-2025, 08:56 AM)Old Steve Wrote: The clusters of Apneas are Positional Apneas they are caused by chin tucking or you are simply in a position that your airway bends. It is like a garden hose that you bend to shut the water off. Pressure will not help it. You must find a position that will, for me that was sleeping on my side rather than my back. Sometimes a lower pillow will help or a soft cervical collar to stop the chin tucking. If you look below I have a link to Positional Apnea that will give you more information. Your flow limits are very bad and as your are already using EPR at 3 all that you can do is raise your minimum pressure I would start at 10cm with a 16cm max pressure and see if that helps. Although, as I said the pressure increase will not fix the Positional Apnea. You must find a solution to that or the pressure increase will not do anything. You also need to work on your air leaks, they can cause arousals and if they are bad leaks the CPAP can not compensate for them by raising the pressure.
Welcome to the forum and good luck with your treatment.
Thank you so much for your kind reply! I think I understand most of it. And I could use a lower pillow (somehow I thought raising my head more with two thin pillows would help ). But unfortunately I can't sleep more than 20% or so on the side due to neck problems and shoulder problems (herniated disc's in the neck has caused nerve damage). :-(
But I'm sorry I didn't understand this: "Your flow limits are very bad and as your are already using EPR at 3 all that you can do is raise your minimum pressure I would start at 10cm with a 16cm max pressure and see if that helps."
I'm sorry but I don't understand what the flow limits are/mean. English is not my native language.
When I tried to use 16 as the highest pressure the mask leaked more. But I'm starting to think the mask isn't a good fit. Because I've tried to adjust it in every possible way and have to have the lower strap so tight it makes the neck worse, and it still leaks. The app MyAir said the mask fitted well last night, but Oscar seems to say differently..
Flow Limitation (FL) - Is a Partial closure of the upper airway, which impedes the flow of air into the lungs.
They are like small apneas causing arousals. Usually full time use of EPR at 3 will help in reducing flow limits, in your case it doesn't seem to be helping much so adding pressure is what we try next.
Machine: Lowenstein Luisa Mask Type: Full face mask Mask Make & Model: Resmed Quattro FX Humidifier: separate F&P humidifier CPAP Pressure: Epap 4-20 PS 4-20; "auto" rate CPAP Software: Not using software
Other Comments: Using 45 degree angle upper body wedge (36"x36") and 4.5"soft cervical collar; 500 assured tidal vol
As far as the nose tickling, you can try either moving the mask further upwards on your face (try this 1st), or even moving the mask further downward on your face. See if either of these adjustments help.
You can always try a little tighter strap tension, or a little looser strap tension as well.
INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
I've had issues with the air on my face too, I'm really sensitive to it. I haven't tried that mask specifically but I've used an Eson 2, a Nova Micro and most recently a Swift FX and it's worked the best for me. The Eson is an over the nose and I find it shifts and leaks onto my face as I move in my sleep, the Micro vents directly into my eyes which is just unbearable, and the Swift which I think they discontinued unfortunately has a vent like the Eson but is nasal like the Micro.
It's frankly amazing how much variance there is for masks that cost this much necessitating experimentation like this.
02-21-2025, 03:52 AM (This post was last modified: 02-21-2025, 03:52 AM by Kessy.)
RE: Newbie, 7 days and still trouble TICKLING
[attachment=75835 Wrote:Deborah K. pid='547405' dateline='1739814122']Your Oscar chart needs a little work. We need to see the following, and only the following, in the order listed:
You can mostly accomplish this by using the f12 button to copy your chart. Ensure that we can read to the very bottom of the Flow Limits.
Oh, sorry, I misread and thought it should me mask pressure- I've adjusted it. I did use the F12 though to make the copy. :-/ I did it now and it looks like this this morning (the numbers are not going in the right direction :-( )
Your Positional Apnea is driving up your pressure to your max pressure almost all the time and is causing you to have more leaks. The clusters of apneas you are having are Positional Apneas and as I said before pressure increases alone will not stop them. You need to change your sleepposition, try side sleeping, shorter pillow, stop tucking your chin down, you may need a soft cervical collar to help hold you neck straighter.
Get control of the positional apnea problem and increase your pressure to 10cm with a 16cm maximum pressure with 3 EPR. Then post some more charts. Once you get control of the Positional Apneas and are using the higher pressure I or someone else on the forum should be able to help fine tune your treatment.
