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Respiratory aerosol
#11
RE: Respiratory aerosol
It seems a large part of the confusion here is that your definition of an aerosol is different from the one I learned, which is pretty much the same as the one in the English Wikipedia:

"An aerosol is a suspension of fine solid particles or liquid droplets, in air or another gas. Aerosols can be natural or anthropogenic. Examples of natural aerosols are fog, dust, forest exudates and geyser steam. Examples of anthropogenic aerosols are haze, particulate air pollutants and smoke."

Perhaps there is a different translation in Spanish?
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#12
RE: Respiratory aerosol
The pressure of a CPAP is very low insufficient to low up a balloon pressure is not an issue
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#13
RE: Respiratory aerosol
legionella pneumophila is a slow growing organism that requires weeks to reach potentially infectious levels in fresh water. Since CPAP components do not remain continuously moist for such long periods of time, (with the exception of the humidifier chamber in the case of those who never drain or clean it) any organisms that could be present would never reach hazardous numbers and would die on dry surfaces between uses. You appear to suggest that the organisms are entering the CPAP in the air stream but from where? The habitat of the organism is fresh water and it is not found free in the air or on dust. It is spread by fresh water droplet aerosols which are not likely to be present in our bedroom air.

You state that room humidifiers do not create aerosols but that is not true. The most popular cool mist models humidify the air by generating droplet aerosols. If not routinely cleaned, they are much more likely to cause legionella infection than CPAP machines.

Please understand, I'm not trying to be argumentative but as a microbiologist, want to be sure that readers of this forum do not become concerned they are at risk acquiring legionella infections from their CPAP equipment.
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#14
RE: Respiratory aerosol
The incremental humidity resulting from air passing over warm water is not an aerosol, unless it is subsequently cooled to the condensation (dew) point.
Sleeprider
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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
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#15
RE: Respiratory aerosol
Pall did a study several years ago to support the use of antibacterial filters downstream of the humidifier and hose. They inoculated the reservoirs with bacteria and cultured and recovered them from the hoses and masks which proves there is some aerosolization. As I recall they used Resmed S9 machines. When my S10 runs I see some disturbance of the surface of the water. It doesn't take much to generate an aerosol. Simply dipping a wire inoculating loop in a a liquid containing bacteria and removing it will generate an aerosol that can be recovered on petri dishes near the container. That's why, in the clinical lab we always performed even the simplest procedures in a negative pressure biosafety cabinet when working with dangerous pathogens. Fortunately most bacteria, even most pathogens aren't that dangerous.
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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.

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#16
RE: Respiratory aerosol
Here's the link to the Pall study.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2556912/

As it turns out my memory was a little off. They only sampled the tubing and they used S7 machines. There is no doubt, however, that they detected aerosolizatin. Interestingly, SoClean references this study in support of their system even though it has no relevance.
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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.

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#17
RE: Respiratory aerosol
(02-23-2020, 09:26 PM)Melman Wrote: legionella pneumophila is a slow growing organism that requires weeks to reach potentially infectious levels in fresh water. Since CPAP components do not remain continuously moist for such long periods of time, (with the exception of the humidifier chamber in the case of those who never drain or clean it) any organisms that could be present would never reach hazardous numbers and would die on dry surfaces between uses. You appear to suggest that the organisms are entering the CPAP in the air stream but from where? The habitat of the organism is fresh water and it is not found free in the air or on dust. It is spread by fresh water droplet aerosols which are not likely to be present in our bedroom air.

You state that room humidifiers do not create aerosols but that is not true. The most popular cool mist models humidify the air by generating droplet aerosols. If not routinely cleaned, they are much more likely to cause legionella infection than CPAP machines.

Please understand, I'm not trying to be argumentative but as a microbiologist, want to be sure that readers of this forum do not become concerned they are at risk acquiring legionella infections from their CPAP equipment.

I already commented that I didn't want to generate controversy, Melman. I am also a microbiologist. Greetings.
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#18
RE: Respiratory aerosol
astracan,

 I also had the same concerns(wrongly) as you. Here is a thread that I started and it is related to your concerns.

http://www.apneaboard.com/forums/Thread-...humidifier

Hope it helps, car54
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