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Dirty Tricks... Long Story Bro...
#1
I am in a small town in Ontario Canada. I just finished my sleep study, and was given a prescription which has a few clinics listed on it that I can see in my area. There is only 1 listed in my town, and it is run by the hospital. They pretend to be a not for profit, but they seem to be greedy cash pigs.

The Ontario govt pays 75% of the cost of a manual CPAP, and they have set (fixed) the price the same on 6 or so CPAP machines under their funding program. The vendors must sell the machines at a fixed price, include a basic mask, and offer a 3 year warranty. But nobody tells you this.

Here are the scams my local clinic tried on me:
The clinic gives me only 3 options. Bronze Silver and Gold.
1-Bronze is a brick for $215. A good mask is $200 to $300 more.
2-Silver is bit better, includes the mask, my cost is $900.
3-Gold is the best manual machine, Remstar Pro. Mask included. my cost is $1335.
The gold and silver include some small things like 1 reading per year, yearly checkup and filter etc. Nothing much more.

So here's the scam. The Ontario govt sets and fixes the price on all machines at $215. So the $1335 deal, is really $215 plus a mask. I bought a Fisher pillow mask new online for $80. I am able to buy their $1335 deal for $215 + $80= $295, less some basic minimal services. So when I asked for just the machine for $215 they reluctantly said they would. (The govt sets the price and they must sell it with a basic mask and 3 year warranty.) So the are scamming people for about $1000 more than they need to pay.

Couple of extra little scams. When I asked them to just sell me the full data machine, she says yes, but I won't be able to record any data as it won't come with the factory card, so it will be a brick. I say that I can use any card. She says again, it won't have the special card from the factory, so it won't record. Again I say it will take any flash card and she reluctantly agrees.

BUT- She says I will need to bring it in once a year for a warranty check, for a fee, to keep my warranty. She explains this is set from the manufacturer to ensure the machine is being properly maintained and without me bringing it in yearly for a fee, my warranty will be voided...

^Both the card removal and the "factory required" yearly checkup seem to only apply at this clinic. Other places I called include the card, as well as the 3 year warranty without seeing the machine every year. Also the other clinics volunteered the info about all machines being $215, and recommended getting only the top units.

There were many other things that I found to be less than professional in my treatment during this whole process. The loaner machine came with 3 masks, 2 did not work properly...etc...

This local clinic does not offer the Resmed A10 Elite, so I am using a different clinic out of town.



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#2
(02-13-2015, 12:26 AM)player Wrote: BUT- She says I will need to bring it in once a year for a warranty check, for a fee, to keep my warranty. She explains this is set from the manufacturer to ensure the machine is being properly maintained and without me bringing it in yearly for a fee, my warranty will be voided.

Ask her to put the warranty bit in writing. Even if she won't do that, report it to Philips.

Get the free SleepyHead software here.
Useful links.
Click here for information on the main alternative to CPAP.
If it's midnight and a DME tells you it's dark outside, go and check it yourself.
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#3
I am glad to be moving on.

Of course one of them told me at one point it was illegal for a "patient" to adjust their own machine. When I asked about this she said it is a controlled prescription and tampering with it is a crime. This whole thing is such a scam...
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#4
I am glad to be moving on.

Of course one of them told me at one point it was illegal for a "patient" to adjust their own machine. When I asked about this she said it is a controlled prescription and tampering with it is a crime. This whole thing is such a scam...

The $1335 price is after they get $675 from the Govt. That is listed at $2010 less the $675= $1335
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#5
Hi player,
The funding from what I understand is for the base model blower/nasal mask/hose ,a bare bones package so to speak, this is fixed.If one wants the" luxury "items or upgrades like data capable, sd card,a humidifier , stainless steel water tub, slim line or climate line etc these can be add ons , yearly check ups etc and that is where the difference in $ comes in, seems each has a different marketing technique , same as every other business... to try to make it confusing for us to compare apples to oranges.
Glad you called around to find fully data capable machine you want and found this site for self empowerment.
All the best,
3
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#6
(02-13-2015, 09:16 AM)3porpoise Wrote: Hi player,
The funding from what I understand is for the base model blower/nasal mask/hose ,a bare bones package so to speak, this is fixed.If one wants the" luxury "items or upgrades like data capable, sd card,a humidifier , stainless steel water tub, slim line or climate line etc these can be add ons , yearly check ups etc and that is where the difference in $ comes in, seems each has a different marketing technique , same as every other business... to try to make it confusing for us to compare apples to oranges.
Glad you called around to find fully data capable machine you want and found this site for self empowerment.
All the best,
3

Actually the data card, the top machines for manual CPAP (full data capable), a basic mask and 3 year warranty are all part of the govt's plan. It is the crappy clinic that try to suck people into buying a brick when they could get an A10 Elite for the same money. All the other companies (clinics) I talked to only offer the top machines available under the funding. Only this local clinic is giving people the lesser unit even though they qualify for a much better unit at the exact same price.

The clinic I went to today set me up with a brand new Resmed 10 Elite (the other clinic gave me a used Philips to try).

The new clinic also gave me 2 top masks that are BRAND NEW in sealed bags. I asked what they do with them after, and he told me they return them to the manufacturers for credit. The other place gives out used (ugh) loaner masks that are all tangled up in a file cabinet drawer. Two of the three masks were not working properly.

They are loaning the new A10 Elite and monitoring me for 30 days, plus using the modem for remote monitoring. The other place- 2 weeks. They don't offer the A10's so no monitoring. When the 30 days are up, I can buy the A10 Elite for $215. Another $300 gets me their help and monitoring for 5 years.

The guy today read my chip from the other loaner, showed me on a monitor what was happening. The other company did not do anything like that. They suck.
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#7

Actually the data card, the top machines for manual CPAP (full data capable), a basic mask and 3 year warranty are all part of the govt's plan. It is the crappy clinic that try to suck people into buying a brick when they could get an A10 Elite for the same money. All the other companies (clinics) I talked to only offer the top machines available under the funding. Only this local clinic is giving people the lesser unit even though they qualify for a much better unit at the exact same price.

The clinic I went to today set me up with a brand new Resmed 10 Elite (the other clinic gave me a used Philips to try).

The new clinic also gave me 2 top masks that are BRAND NEW in sealed bags. I asked what they do with them after, and he told me they return them to the manufacturers for credit. The other place gives out used (ugh) loaner masks that are all tangled up in a file cabinet drawer. Two of the three masks were not working properly.

They are loaning the new A10 Elite and monitoring me for 30 days, plus using the modem for remote monitoring. The other place- 2 weeks. They don't offer the A10's so no monitoring. When the 30 days are up, I can buy the A10 Elite for $215. Another $300 gets me their help and monitoring for 5 years.

The guy today read my chip from the other loaner, showed me on a monitor what was happening. The other company did not do anything like that. They suck.
[/quote]

Hi player,
Good job! Crappy place sucks, new place rocks! Now you can enlighten people in your community about the new place...when they need it.
Sleep well.
3
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#8
As you no doubt know, manufacturers cannot impose extra conditions with regard to a warranty such as servicing or inspections.

Every Resmed machine I have owned since I started therapy in 1996 has never needed annual check ups or cleaning/servicing.

If it dies you return it, simple as that.
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#9
Hi Player,
Welcome to this wonderful board. I'm a newbie myself. Are the monetary units you mention in USD or Canadian Dollars?

That 300.00 of "help" is that for getting you supply replacements, trying new masks, figuring out your settings etc? Or is that just for machine "help" Even if for the former, I've learned far more from the folk here than I've ever learned/gotten from my USA equivalent "helpers" assuming yours are techs of some type.

Go you on talking them up and researching for a far better machine. Does your elite have a removable data card? If not, did they have an Resmed Airsense Autoset 10 available? (I ask this as you are on a trial period)

Best wishes on this adjustment. The learning curve can be steep, don't be discouraged if you don't find nirvana overnight, many don't, some do. But in a few weeks at most, you should be felling a good deal better. I am and my AHI isn't even consistently under 5.0, but it beats the high level 26.6 I had when I had my study.

Susan AKA The Manse Hen
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#10
Everything is Canadian dollars.

The $300 is for 5 years of help. Trying the machine for 30 days, masks etc. and the help for that period is free. The guy said he would be accessing the machine remotely to see how I am doing over the 30 days.

The cost to me of the A10 Elite will be $215. It comes with a basic mask, but a good one will be at usual retail pricing. The heated hose will be extra as well, at a cost of $100 more. I see the hose is $54 plus shipping Canadian online... I think the extra $30 is a small up-charge for the help.

Yes the new A10 Elite has a data card. We are not allowed auto machines without meeting very specific criteria during the sleep studies.

Thanks for the encouragement. I am looking forward to feeling better. I was at 37/hour during my sleep study.

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