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ResMed Hose Length?
#11
Tie the machine down, put it in a drawer, tie down the hose or do something so you don't turn the machine over.

Some people found that their bilevel/BiPAP/VPAP machines had trouble with long hoses. EPR or Flex might also have some problems. I think the people doing this had extra long hoses.

If the therapy works OK, and you feel OK, don't worry too much. You might find your machine is a little less effective in detecting apneas with the long hose.
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Useful links.
Click here for information on the main alternative to CPAP.
If it's midnight and a DME tells you it's dark outside, go and check it yourself.
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#12
After reading the above I have now strapped the CPAP to the table with a long tie-wrap. Bob.
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#13
(11-01-2012, 11:35 PM)BobF Wrote: I got a 10' hose. Someone told me that the extra length hose required a different pressure setting. My AHI has been really low with 12 cm H2O pressure setting. Is there any truth to this about the hose length and pressure? Regards, Bob.

Hi BobF,

The xPAP machine tries to maintain the correct pressure reaching the mask (and you), by taking into account the pressure lost across the hose, and to do that accurately it needs to know how wide and how long the hose is. The User Guide or Clinician's Manual probably says how to tell the machine what type and length hose is being used.

If your machine is AutoPAP and the machine miscalculates the pressure lost across the hose (because it is not set to correct hose type and length), it is not important (because the machine automatically adjusts pressure based on how well you are breathing) and only affects the accuracy of the reported pressure. The actual pressure may be different than the reported pressure but the actual pressure still gets adjusted to whatever is needed to maintain good breathing.

However, if your machine is not an Auto machine, any miscalculation in how much pressure is lost across the hose will directly affect the actual pressure reaching the mask (and you). The greater the air flow because of Leak the lower will be the pressure reaching the mask, unless the machine is correctly set for the type of hose.

The standard fat short hose does not drop much pressure even if the Leak is fairly large. But the slimline hose drops a lot more when Leak is large. If you use a 10 ft hose, be sure it is regular width, not Slimline. (I think if any company is selling a 10 ft slimline hose, it would not be a reputable company, because I don't know of any xPAP machine that can be set for a 10 ft slimline hose.)

When using Slimline hose it is especially important that the machine knows the correct hose type and length whenever Leak (either unintentional or intentional) is large, such as whenever the pressure is high (above a pressure of 15, I'd guess the intentional leakage through the mask vent holes might start getting large) or whenever there are unintentional leaks.

Take care.
Membership in the Advisory Member group should not be understood as in any way implying medical expertise or qualification for advising Sleep Apnea patients concerning their treatment. The Advisory Member group provides advice and suggestions to Apnea Board administrators and staff on matters concerning Apnea Board operation and administrative policies - not on matters concerning treatment for Sleep Apnea. I think it is now too late to change the name of the group but I think Voting Member group would perhaps have been a more descriptive name for the group.
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#14
Hi. Thanks for the great info. It backs up what I had heard. I started out with the 6' hose. My settings per the Sleep Lab was to be 9 cm H2O. It was not working for me as my AHI's were too high and erratic. My doctor said to set it to 12 cm H20. Since then I have used the 10' hose and my AHI's are really low. My doctor has reviewed my results, plotted out with Excel, and he was satisfied with the results. I guess the longer hose pressure drop is doing OK for me with the 12 Cm H2O setting. Regards, Bob.
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#15
It would be interesting to test this out. You can make your own manometer.

Let me see if I can get this right.

Take a container of water at least as deep as your pressure number. Meaning if yours is set to 12, then you need a container at least 12cm deep.

Mark 12cm on the regular hose and the 10' one.

Put on the 6' hose and put it in the water up to that mark. Keep the hose as straight as possible. Turn on the machine. The machine should push all of that water out of the hose.

Do the same with the 10' one.

It would be interesting to see the results!
PaulaO2
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INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.




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#16
(11-03-2012, 05:54 PM)PaulaO2 Wrote: It would be interesting to test this out. You can make your own manometer.
It would be interesting to see the results!

Interesting, indeed. And it would also be interesting if someone would test a 15 mm hose and a 22 mm hose of the same length to see if the width of the hose makes any difference and, if so, how much.

My machine has the older firmware which does not have a setting for the newer 15 mm hoses. I'd love to get a 15 mm hose, and I can easily buy one, but I don't know how much the new firmware adjusts the pressure when the user sets it to 15 mm.

It would be great to have the results of scientific inquiries like these on the wiki.
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#17
(11-03-2012, 05:54 PM)PaulaO2 Wrote: It would be interesting to test this out. You can make your own manometer.

Let me see if I can get this right.

Take a container of water at least as deep as your pressure number. Meaning if yours is set to 12, then you need a container at least 12cm deep.

Mark 12cm on the regular hose and the 10' one.

Put on the 6' hose and put it in the water up to that mark. Keep the hose as straight as possible. Turn on the machine. The machine should push all of that water out of the hose.

Do the same with the 10' one.

It would be interesting to see the results!

That won't work for determining the pressure drop caused by the hose. If the hose causes a pressure drop, it will only do so when there is air flowing through the hose. With no airflow, the pressure at both ends of the hose will be the same.

If you're concerned about the effect of the hose, you'll have to get an inline connector and manometer like this and use it while connected to the mask.

[Image: ISP9910_400_A.jpg]

Once you have the inline connector and the connected air tube, you could theoretically use the end of the tube under water to measure the pressure. It's probably going to be difficult to measure the small pressure change you're looking for with water, especially since it will probably vary as you inhale and exhale.
Get the free SleepyHead software here.
Useful links.
Click here for information on the main alternative to CPAP.
If it's midnight and a DME tells you it's dark outside, go and check it yourself.
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#18
(11-03-2012, 08:08 PM)archangle Wrote: That won't work for determining the pressure drop caused by the hose. If the hose causes a pressure drop, it will only do so when there is air flowing through the hose. With no airflow, the pressure at both ends of the hose will be the same.
If you're concerned about the effect of the hose, you'll have to get an inline connector and manometer like this and use it while connected to the mask.

[Image: ISP9910_400_A.jpg]

Once you have the inline connector and the connected air tube, you could theoretically use the end of the tube under water to measure the pressure. It's probably going to be difficult to measure the small pressure change you're looking for with water, especially since it will probably vary as you inhale and exhale.

Can you suggest a place to buy one of the above inline connectors? One of our providers? Someplace else? (Bear in mind that you can't post commercial URLs here.)
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#19
(11-03-2012, 08:31 PM)JJJ Wrote: Can you suggest a place to buy one of the above inline connectors? One of our providers? Someplace else? (Bear in mind that you can't post commercial URLs here.)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invacare
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#20
Theoretically, there is a drop in pressure with increased hose length.

However, because the hose length is (at most) 10 feet long, the pressure loss is so minuscule, it is not measurable.

For example, for a flow rate of 0.1 m3/min (approximately a pressure of 5 cm H2O for a Respironics System One APAP), at an initial pressure of 100 psig (which is wwwwwaaaaayyyyyy more than you get from your average XPAP machine), you would only lose 0.22 psi for a 1/2 inch diameter pipe 100 feet long.

Source: Compressed Air Pipeline Pressure Drop Table

Granted, the source used a steel pipe so the actual pressure loss would be a bit higher, but it is STILL not enough to measure.
INFORMATION ON APNEA BOARD FORUMS OR ON APNEABOARD.COM SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED AS MEDICAL ADVICE. ALWAYS SEEK THE ADVICE OF A PHYSICIAN BEFORE SEEKING TREATMENT FOR MEDICAL CONDITIONS, INCLUDING SLEEP APNEA. INFORMATION POSTED ON THE APNEA BOARD WEB SITE AND FORUMS ARE PERSONAL OPINION ONLY AND NOT NECESSARILY A STATEMENT OF FACT.
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